Optic for LE rural patrol use

[deercop]

This is my "primary" M4 as she currently is. It's a LMT Defender 2000. Everything that's been changed or added is because of a definite reason, not just because it looks cool. It has the AAC Blackout flash suppressor, GG&G 1913 rail piece, Surefire 6P w/ LED mounted in Vltor scout mount, Colt side-sling adapter, BFG VCAS padded sling, Magpul CTR stock, Tango Down Battlegrip, Midwest Industries SPLP BUIS, and a Trijicon ACOG TA33-8 with Butler Creek flip caps.

[decodeddiesel]

I too was going to recommend the TA33-8. For the requirements you listed I think it would suit you perfectly.

Something you might want to consider would be a butler creek flip cap for the front. When in covered in daylight it can act much like a reflex optic for close ranges.

Funny enough, I have tried the flip cap technique...it works well, but I seem to be able to use it in CQB faster with it open. I did have formal training on a TA-31F in the Army though so I think that helps.

[decodeddiesel]

This is my "primary" M4 as she currently is. It's a LMT Defender 2000. Everything that's been changed or added is because of a definite reason, not just because it looks cool. It has the AAC Blackout flash suppressor, GG&G 1913 rail piece, Surefire 6P w/ LED mounted in Vltor scout mount, Colt side-sling adapter, BFG VCAS padded sling, Magpul CTR stock, Tango Down Battlegrip, Midwest Industries SPLP BUIS, and a Trijicon ACOG TA33-8 with Butler Creek flip caps.

SWEET!!!! I love it! Now that is a no non-sense all business work carbine! Well done Sir. I hope you have plenty of P-mags for it!

[MisterWilson]

The only two remaining upgrades I would consider would be a LaRue mount for the ACOG & THIS for the light.

The LaRue mount places the ACOG slightly lower. This makes for, in my opinion, a much better view. With the factory mount I find it higher than I would like while the LT mount places it right in the sweet spot.

As far as the LED upgrade I linked to, I'm not affiliated with the gentleman in any way, shape, form, or fashion. I'm just a guy who bought one and thinks it rocks.

It has better throw and brightness than my new Surefire X300, MUCH better throw than an older Surefire Scout/M600, and better than the G2LED bulb it replaced. While they rate it at 290 lumens, it's actually closer to 200 or so from what I've heard, however at only $20 delivered it's well worth it. I believe it also gets ~5 hours of life so you're not losing much.

[deercop]

I was aware of, considered, and rejected, both of those items.

In regards to the Larue mount, it would cause the ACOG to sit lower, therefore causing a larger "shadow" from the front sight in the field of view. The "quick release" function is also low on my list of priorities.

In regards to the bulb, there IS such a thing as too much light in certain LE applications. IMO the 6P w/ LED is perfect for my normal ops. On the rare occasion that I should I determine I need more light, I also have a M962 that would readily clamp to the rail piece.

But thanks for the suggestions.

[Failure2Stop]

Deercop-
It looks like you probably need to adjust that sling. As it is you have pretty much lost the versatility of the VCAS and produced a snag/catch hazard with the loose front. Now to be fair I have never used that padded version, but given the use/concept of the standard VCAS, I don't see why they would make the padded version incaipable of achieving the same simplicity and ease of use.

About the light-
While the GG&G rail is ok for home/hobbyist use I don't think that it is going to stand up to the thrashing that the woods can give gear, especially if you actually wind up in a gunfight. Also, since the HG is not parallel to bore, the light is going to be pointing down and right, and probably pretty distinctly so at around 25 yards. Since you carry a gun in the line of duty for the protection of others and yourself, you are hereby included in the "Serious User" category. As such, I would recommend that a serious user invest in a good light/mount system. Understandably you might not want/need a rail system. In that case one of the SF dedicated light systems will definitely out-perform your current setup. The M500A forearm is a simple and very effective replacement for your top handguard. Admittedly at $525 (from SureFire) it is not inexpensive. However that cost is pretty reasonable when compared to the option of buying a new railed HG, a light of equal performance, and possibly a mount.

I would not recommend an LED for anything past about 50 yards in the woods other than as a target indicator. An incandescent light of equal power and reflector size to an LED will work much better when it comes to positive ID and cutting through fog and smoke. While the higher powered LEDs are much better than the low power LEDs in CQB, the incan holds it's own outside and for sheer ability to "power through" airborne crap. The advantage of the LED over the incan is battery life and shock resistance, which are easily overcome with proper planning and fore-sight (and you don't need to worry about shock-resistance with the M500A). Naturally, utilization of white light outdoors is a balance of tactical decisions, and whether using an LED of Incandescent, it can easily become a detriment if employed improperly.

One more thing- you might want to seriously consider an MRD of some flavor to supplement the TA33 in case you find yourself in a situatio where you are at close range and using a light.

Anyway, just my opinion and experience. By and large you are up and running with a decent concept. A little tweaking to caipability and you will have a formidable tool at your disposal.

Oh, and BTW- don't be afraid to put the gun on SAFE if you aren't up on a threat.

ETA- after seeing your latest post that came while I was typing this-
Quick release levers are as important as your BUIS, because without them you will not be able to get a properly tensioned mount off of your gun in a timely manner unless you literally go into the fight with a Multi-Tool in your hand.
While there is definately the concept of too much light, it rarely applies to outside an enclosure. I have many time wished I had a more powerful light, and never wished I had less. This is, of course, experiece that may not be reflected in your work.

[deercop]

I have the front part of the sling partially secured with a piece of bicycle innertube, to keep it shorter than normal. A slight tug and it pops loose. Probably why it looks FUBAR to you. Then again I could have it FUBAR, it's the first VCAS I've used.

I have owned (and sold) a M500a before. Wasn't my cup of tea. I've also got a M73 foreend, not my cup of tea either. I ran both of those for an entire hunting season, just to give them a thorough workout in my environment.

Actually my light use with a carbine is minimal, I could probably make do without a light, but you never know. 99% of my dim light use of a long gun is on vehicle stops, and on those occasions I unrack the company-owned Remington 870.

The weapon is off-safe in the pic because I always store my long guns in "cruiser ready", ie hammer down on empty chamber, safety off. Old habits.

ETA: Leatherman "Wave" is on my duty belt.

[Failure2Stop]

The weapon is off-safe in the pic because I always store my long guns in "cruiser ready", ie hammer down on empty chamber, safety off. Old habits.

Aw, I was just yankin' yer chain. I even threw in the squinty-tongue guy to indicate so - .

Gotcha on the innertube/sling- looked like electrical tape. You wouldn't believe the things I have seen people do to good gear and then bitch about it not working.

As far as the rest-
Seems like you tried out a few things and selected what meets your needs.
As long as you're happy, I'm happy.

[deercop]

You wouldn't believe the things I have seen people do to good gear and then bitch about it not working.

So you've met some people from my department?

[wichaka]

deercop, I too work in a very rural environment..........you might look at Hahn Precision's forward light mount. I like it as it keeps everything in line, with nothin hanging off to the side, and the light is even on the target.

I know some don't like the tape switch thing, but keep the cord secured down, and I've not had any problems.