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Thread: Thoughts on RMR on carbine

  1. #31
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    Would anyone be willing to email the study to me? I can't seem to access it. I had this very discussion with one of my soldiers this past weekend and I'd like to read this up on it.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by RHINOWSO View Post
    While it may be subjective, Aimpoint H/T-1s, Comps, and Pros just seem like they could take more abuse than a RMR. But I've never seen a torture test on an RMR, so like I said it could very well be an unwarranted fear.
    They sit exposed on SM's weapons, taking a beating daily. They are pretty durable IME.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by TCBA_Joe View Post
    Would anyone be willing to email the study to me? I can't seem to access it. I had this very discussion with one of my soldiers this past weekend and I'd like to read this up on it.
    Did you try the download link in my post #27? That should work. If it does not, shoot me a PM and I'll email it to you.
    It's not about surviving, it's about winning!

  4. #34
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    What experience do y'all have with the dot size of the dual illumnated models on a rifle? It seems that the dots are all rather large for rifle work...

  5. #35
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    Here is my first hand experience:

    I run an RM08 on my M4. I am currently in Afghanistan. I used the RMR during training prior to deployment and on my personal AR. The 12.9 MOA triangle is as accurate as you are. If you miss, it is your own fault. I think Trijicon triangles/chevrons are the best reticule pattern going. At close range just put the whole triangle on the target. At long range use the apex of the triangle for an infinitely fine sight post.

    I place my RMR flush with the front of the upper receiver.

    I do wish the RMR glass was larger (maybe half again). You do have to get a little more behind the gun to get a good sight picture. It is not as forgiving as an EOTech, Aimpoint, or MARS (which I have also used). But, given it's size, weight, and battery free operation it is worth the trade off.

    It still has some washout issues if you are shooting from indoors into bright daylight but it is not as bad as the RX series. If the target is a dark color it is even less of an issue. I am not bothered by it enough to switch to an EOTech (which is issued in my kit) because it has yet to be an issue here. If I were really pressed I would just use my front sight post and use the body of the RMR as a large ghost ring. I tried this in training and I did not have a problem.

    If you do have a really sweet deal on an RMR, hook a brother up! I plan to put these on most of my personal rifles and shotguns.

  6. #36
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    I like the RMR on my ACOG. It's worked out well for me so far. No loss of zero. Cheek weld really isn't as bad as you would expect...


  7. #37
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    What that study says is true as long as you can achieve a good cheeckweld such as the standing postition they used in the test. When you throw in unconventional postions such SBU prone, urban prone, etc... having the sight farther away from your eye makes aquiring the dot a slower process. This is because you are not able to maintain an optimal viewing angle through the sight. The main "gotcha" with the Dutch test is, according to the method they used, is that they only ran the test in the standing postion.

    In regards to the eye box, my definition of it is the box/window/occular lens where you look through to aquire the dot. The farther the sight is from your eye the smaller the "box" you will have to look through to find the dot. Meaning you will need better cheekweld to see the dot so you loose a portion of the "forgiveness" that red dot sights offer when shooting in unconventional positons. I believe this also what Mistwolf is referring to in his post above.

    The issue is finding the sweet spot for each individual which will not necessaryly be the same due to various reasons...

    Quote Originally Posted by Arctic1 View Post
    Are you referring to the RMR specifically, or red dot sights in general?

    If so, I respectfully disagree with your statement regarding difficulty in picking up the dot.

    There was a Dutch study done on optics placement on the rifle, and it concluded that an optic placed halfway out on the rail forend was both faster and more accurate than optics placed further back. An optic placed just in front of the upper reciever was perceived to be the best.

    A few pics from the study:






    Here is the full study:

    http://rapidshare.com/files/23144366...ngavoptikk.pdf

    Personal preference also plays a role.

    Personally I mount the optic as far forward on the upper as possible, but not on the handguard. We had some issues retaining zero on our weapons when removing the rail for maintenance, as the mounting screw needs a consistent torque of 7N in order to retain zero.

    As for the cheekweld issue, I don't know what the parallax balance is on the RMR, but I use a Docter III on my S&W MP9, and it has a parallax balance of 40 meters. If you are shooting at close distances, parallax won't/shouldn't be an issue. I wouldn't mind having a mount that pushed the optic out further, but I have to use the issued mount.
    Last edited by Yojimbo; 03-17-13 at 12:58.

  8. #38
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    Thank you for that link! That was some good reading. I just have one question and maybe someone on here could answer it, the presentation showed that the best place for your Aimpoint granted that you do not have a 3x, NV, etc, on it would be in position 3, I was told that it is best to keep it as far forward as you could but still keeping it on the rear receiver like position 2. I know splitting the optic half and half is a no go. So why position 3? I understand the balance aspect. I see the results given in the presentation, and I was kinda surprised. You guys have much more experience then I do obviously, and I am sorry for the slight thread hijack. It is just a question that I have always had. I have tried this with my Aimpoint PRO and I did not find it better for me, easier or any quicker for picking up targets.

    Again I am sorry for going off topic but I did not think it was appropriate for me to open a new thread and take up more space when it seems like the question could be answered here. Thank you all.


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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by scoutfsu99 View Post
    They sit exposed on SM's weapons, taking a beating daily. They are pretty durable IME.
    Thanks for the input, it seems like Trijicon made them pretty tough. I'm considering one to try on my two light SBRs.

  10. #40
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    I have the ACOG/RMR on my AR that I mounted and sighted in on Saturday, with the RMR being so high and my cheek weild being low (ace fixed stock) I have to say it took a little bit to get used to where I had to be to find the dot. It wouldn't be near as bad mounted to the rail of course. The dot is super crisp and very bright even in the 90 degrees weather we had on Saturday with this west Texas sun. It was also almost zeroed at 50 yards, which is where the owners manuel says to zero, and stayed super crisp through some rapid fire.

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