A New How To: Get Killed in a Fire Fight.

[ICANHITHIMMAN]

Hard to arm chair this stuff, but based of their demeanor, I would say they were just in experienced and the ones who lived will learn from it.

[Airhasz]

Life is cheap in Colombia...

[dash1]

Why is he wearing a blue armband? Wtf is the point of camo?

It is probably for friend or foe identification.

[SOWT]

Counter-Narcotics Police (that's why they have blue on).

Love the AC-47.

[VMI-MO]

I hate monday morning quarter backing other peoples gunfights.

They didn't have 360,
no base of fire, they didn't manuever to contact, no coordination with CAS, nothing.. They pretty much just sat and waited to get killed.

Our perspective of the gunfight was limited to 15m of their frontage, there was no way to see if they had complete security or not. Also their isnt always a need for "360". Sometimes you dont have the manpower to "360".


Maneuver to contact? You mean movement to contact? They were already in contact. No need to maneuver to it.


Who knows what type of comms these guys had to be able to talk to air. From the looks this was a squad pushed out from a platoon sized element. Platoon leadership probably retained the ability to control air.

Why is he wearing a blue armband? Wtf is the point of camo?

I will go out on a limb and say the FARC or whoever these dudes were have access to the uniforms used by the government troops. Blue is a fairly subdued color but would still stand out as IFF.

Wow. That was like watching high school kids play paintball.

There is way to much unknown to start blasting these guys. Did they just finish an attack and are winchester on ammo, water etc? What if their orders were to not be decisively engaged?


Judging by their comms they were split into different elements, who knows what the actual task of the squad we were watching was. It might have been secure the LZ, not "go pick a fight".

To many unknowns......

. He's lucky they captured him alive and didn't behead him while filming it with his own camera.

Im pretty sure the FARC dont have a history of head choppers. Im not 100% on that.


PJ

[Endur]

I hate monday morning quarter backing other peoples gunfights.



Our perspective of the gunfight was limited to 15m of their frontage, there was no way to see if they had complete security or not. Also their isnt always a need for "360". Sometimes you dont have the manpower to "360".


Maneuver to contact? You mean movement to contact? They were already in contact. No need to maneuver to it.


Who knows what type of comms these guys had to be able to talk to air. From the looks this was a squad pushed out from a platoon sized element. Platoon leadership probably retained the ability to control air.

Having 360 security is not hard to accomplish even with minimal personnel. When you receive contact you supress fire and flank. They didn't maneuver to contact or there was no movement to contact, depends how you say it. They just sat there. Even squads have the ability to utilize CAS. We did it all the time. The eight minutes of video was enough to know the men in the video did not know what to do or they just didn't do what they knew.

[Smash]

You seriously don't know enough about this situation to comment. And if you do come forward and tell us how you know so much about the military or counter-guerrilla warfare in Colombia. Were you a Colombian soldier because you seem to know exactly what they can do, what they're TTPs are, and what assets they had delegated down to their lowest level. Just because you may have done something as an American doesnt mean the whole world does everything the same way. Saying a bunch of military acronyms and verbiage doesn't mean you're right.

Having 360 security is not hard to accomplish even with minimal personnel. When you receive contact you supress fire and flank. They didn't maneuver to contact or there was no movement to contact, depends how you say it. They just sat there. Even squads have the ability to utilize CAS. We did it all the time. The eight minutes of video was enough to know the men in the video did not know what to do or they just didn't do what they knew.

Try to hold everything and hold nothing at all. You don't know their complete capabilities or enemy force based on the video.

Do you know that in Colombia they push assets that low?

Really? When you were in Colombia you did? Tell us about when you did.



I'm not saying what they did was perfect. I'm not saying it was wrong. This could be used as training video if you're sitting around with your unit and would like to discuss what you would want to do in that situation with your specific assets and capabilities. But talking about it in a definitely this or definitely that mentality specifically about them when you only know what the one video showed is exactly what VMI said Monday Morning Quarterbacking.

[Endur]

You seriously don't know enough about this situation to comment. And if you do come forward and tell us how you know so much about the military or counter-guerrilla warfare in Colombia. Were you a Colombian soldier because you seem to know exactly what they can do, what they're TTPs are, and what assets they had delegated down to their lowest level. Just because you may have done something as an American doesnt mean the whole world does everything the same way. Saying a bunch of military acronyms and verbiage doesn't mean you're right.



Try to hold everything and hold nothing at all. You don't know their complete capabilities or enemy force based on the video.

Do you know that in Colombia they push assets that low?

Really? When you were in Colombia you did? Tell us about when you did.



I'm not saying what they did was perfect. I'm not saying it was wrong. This could be used as training video if you're sitting around with your unit and would like to discuss what you would want to do in that situation with your specific assets and capabilities. But talking about it in a definitely this or definitely that mentality specifically about them when you only know what the one video showed is exactly what VMI said Monday Morning Quarterbacking.

Some of you are trying to get way too personal and there is no reason to. No one said their SOP's and TTP's are the same as American. Across the board I bet they are similiar. Having security isn't trying to hold everything. It is common sense. Who knows if they push assets that low but they could have requested it, by that video they didn't. I was referring to my deployments and not Colombia.

To sit there and argue that it can't be said they did anything wrong when what WAS shown in the video shows they didn't do much of anything which IS wrong, is either arguing for the sake of arguing or stupidity.

Call it what you want but from what is shown I can clearly see if they had done things differently they might still be alive, whether or not their way of doing it is different from ours or anyone elses. If you or anyone else doesn't like it, charlie mic. I have my opinion, you have yours. I believe they ****ed up and it cost them their lives.

This could be used as training video if you're sitting around with your unit and would like to discuss what you would want to do in that situation with your specific assets and capabilities.

This was what I was trying to do. Instead of saying what I would have done I said it in the aspect of what they did not by what was shown.

[Smash]

Nothing personal. You're breaking down something from another country when you don't know more than an 8 minute clip.

They should have used their howitzers and tanks. I don't know why they didn't. But in the 8 minutes of video they didn't even request them. IR lasers and drones is what they should have used. It's what we did on my deployments. I don't know why they didn't.

Seem silly?

[Endur]

Nothing personal. You're breaking down something from another country when you don't know more than an 8 minute clip.

They should have used their howitzers and tanks. I don't know why they didn't. But in the 8 minutes of video they didn't even request them. IR lasers and drones is what they should have used. It's what we did on my deployments. I don't know why they didn't.

Seem silly?

No it does not seem silly because that is way beyond basic tactics and common sense like "hey they are shooting, maybe we should fight back". The only reason I mentioned CAS was they already had it in the video. If they had any other assets in the video as well and didn't atleast try and use them I would have said something about that as well.

----

I am going to un-**** this thread and put it back in the right direction. Above all else and with out a doubt whether it was shown in the clip or not, it is clear that more could have been done. There wasn't much comms from their leadership unless they were heavily occupied. Curious as to why.