People that have never received training please read!

[serbonze]

My first "real" classes were VSM Basic Pistol and VSM Basic Carbine. I had done nothing but static range shooting fom a bench or standing in a stall. It was an eye opening experience to receive proper instruction from a qualified instructor, and the training scars that had been developed from a lifetime of having no idea what I was doing. "You don't know what you don't know" is a phrase that was used that weekend, and it sticks with me today. I still go back and take basic level classes just to keep my fundamentals sharp. I don't believe that you can ever be too good to work on the basics.

[SeriousStudent]

My first "real" classes were VSM Basic Pistol and VSM Basic Carbine. I had done nothing but static range shooting fom a bench or standing in a stall. It was an eye opening experience to receive proper instruction from a qualified instructor, and the training scars that had been developed from a lifetime of having no idea what I was doing. "You don't know what you don't know" is a phrase that was used that weekend, and it sticks with me today. I still go back and take basic level classes just to keep my fundamentals sharp. I don't believe that you can ever be too good to work on the basics.

There is a lot of brains in this post. Thank you for saying that.

I have often heard that excellence is the fundamentals executed cold, on demand, under any conditions.

[krisjon]

"You don't know what you don't know" is a phrase that was used that weekend, and it sticks with me today. I still go back and take basic level classes just to keep my fundamentals sharp. I don't believe that you can ever be too good to work on the basics.

So true. I trained with John McPhee recently or "Shrek" as he's more widely known. A no BS, former Delta guy and an excellent instructor. It was a 2-day carbine class, but guess what? We spent half the time shooting pistol and focusing on good fundamentals. Why? Because good pistol skills translate over when you switch to a rifle. When we finally started carbine drills, I could really feel the difference/improvement. Learned more in 2 days than I could have in 2 months with someone else.

Heard the same thing from LAV in his classes. Get those basics to stick with you, never stop practicing them and you're better off on whatever you pick up to shoot.

[Chatterbox]

Not enough (none really) emphasis on dry fire.

Just a few to snap in will reveal flinches and such. Once a person becomes conscious of it they can shoot live rounds much better. From there it is refinement.

I would like to expand on that. I decided to get training about 4 years ago, and over that time I took 4 carbine classes - two from "brand-name" instructors and two from local instructors who were also very good. I learned a lot from those classes.

However - my overall shooting performance has not improved very much. Why? Because I had no idea how I should practice on my own. I would go out in the desert and try to replicate what I learned in the class (5 months earlier) with indifferent success. I feel all of the instructors have missed an opportunity to talk about how we should be training outside the class. No mention of drills, no mention of dry-fire, no structure given as to what to do after the class was over. I could understand it I was attending advanced training, but 3 out of 4 were Level 1 classes I kept attending, because I felt I wasn't really learning that much. So instructors - please don't assume that your students automatically know what they need to do after the class to become better shooters. It may not be the case.

[Chatterbox]

A big problem for me and my area especially since my only shooting spot just go closed down- hopefully for just fire season.

Grant do you ever do basic carbine classes without pistols being required? That is the biggest stumbling block for me joining a class. That and looking at traveling across country for a, sometimes, one day basic class.

I live in SoCal, so I would drive from 8-12 hrs to take a quality class if I can find one.

It looks like I am stuck for two more years until I can buy a handgun.

Zane,

There are a number of good schools in SoCal which should be within 1-2 hours for you:
ITTS
Falcon Operations Group
Academy of St Crispian

Grey Group regularly has instructors come out several times a year here.

Check out the list of current training classes here:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/f...ysprune=&f=211

If you do not have a handgun, you still can take a carbine class. You'll lose some value in not being able to practice transitions, but that's about 5% of what you'll learn.