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Thread: Help with major rust problem on my MK12.

  1. #31
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    Just curious if anyone has used closed cell foam like a sleeping matt?

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridgerunner665 View Post
    You folks have probably never heard if this stuff...

    BUT IT WORKS....it is lanolin based, safe for wood, plastic, rubber, paint, any metal....anything. Excellent lubrication and protection...not so much for cleaning though.

    It doesn't dry out either...I've even used for fifth wheel lube on a tractor trailer...it lasts longer than grease.

    It's called "Fluid Film".... Google it or look it up on YouTube...I've used it on my guns for 2 years now, nothing else compares.

    http://www.fluid-film.com/

    Can be found at most any Case or New Holland construction or agriculture equipment dealer.

    Caterpillar, Case, New Holland, John Deere, etc....they all spray equipment that gets shipped overseas with this stuff...even when shipped top deck and uncovered....they arrive rust free after weeks at sea.

    Some say it will begin to get gummy.....at about -10 F...I have not seen this though, I also use it on ratchet binders and it appeared to work just fine at -43 in North Dakota last winter...I haven't had my guns out in weather that cold, I prefer to not get myself out in it either...but sometimes I have to.

    My guns are always stored ready for long term...after deer season, I leave home sometime in the first week of January and most likely won't be back until the middle of May.
    i undercoat my truck with this stuff every fall, i have often thought of using it on my pistols for lube, it has a nice consistency.


    As for rust, i have yet to see a better preservative than eezox.

    Also interested in who chrome lined this ss barrel

  3. #33
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    I am probably wrong that it is not chrome lined, but it s a SS barrel. I ordered it from Fulton last year, and the total specs escape me at this point. From what I remember:

    Douglas barrel, DMR Navy overrun, 18.5" 1/8 twist.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mauser KAR98K View Post
    I am probably wrong that it is not chrome lined, but it s a SS barrel. I ordered it from Fulton last year, and the total specs escape me at this point. From what I remember:

    Douglas barrel, DMR Navy overrun, 18.5" 1/8 twist.
    Chrome lining wouldn't make much sense on an SS barrel.

    I wish you the best of luck. Expensive lesson right there if you can't fix it.
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  5. #35
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    Maybe more upkeep is in order. I've been called anal retentive and OCD by many friends and family. Every single Sunday I get every firearm I own out to inspect and re-oil if they need it or not. Pistols, shotguns, and rifles, everything. My home is climate controlled so it's probably not needed. That doesn't stop me though. Dad is the same way, so was Grandpa.

    It's not hard to do, I usually do it front of the TV. I also don't keep firearms in cases unless I'm taking them somewhere. I usually oil them before I go target shooting, so my case foam has lube all through it, water would have a hard time finding a place to condense. They get their own room(safe) with silica absorbent. I know I'm on the very extreme end of upkeep (I'm sure their are others that may be more extreme) but I've never found a spot of rust or a wood stock that has warped (knocking on said stock material). I live in a humid climate so doing this gives me piece of mind.

    Good luck, I hope you don't need to pay too much to get it fixed. You may want to start an upkeep schedule that is more often than 3 weeks though. Sorry to hear about your misfortune.
    Last edited by mastiffhound; 08-09-13 at 23:56.
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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ace4059 View Post
    Pelican cases have open celled foam inside. Open foam is terrible for storing guns in because is soaks in moisture and as you found out, creates terrible rust problems. A Pelican is designed for protection during transport, not really for long term storage. If you want to store your gun inside then replace all of the foam with closed cell which will cost you $40-$50 for the large cases.
    I agree, these cases are designed for transport only. Sorry to hear about your problem, this sucks!
    Someday someone may kill you with your own gun, but they should have to beat you to death with it because it is empty.

  7. #37
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    As a FYI for those that are interested.

    Took one of the affected AR's I mentioned previously to the most respected gunsmiths in my area and had him look at the bore and the fouled greenish/brown patches I pulled thru the bore.First off, he said the bore looked fine but wasn't broken in yet.Said the bore surface would lap in thru use and become more polished.

    He said that it was most likely chromium oxide that naturally forms on chrome surfaces from exposure to oxygen.Visually I would not see it on the surface beyond maybe a dull finish but will put dark gray/green on a patch if polished.

    The chrome oxide is unaffected by most environmental conditions and chemicals and once formed on hard chrome acts as a nearly impenetrable barrier for the surface.This is why chrome is used in so many applications as a tough barrier coating.Stainless steel behaves in the same way due to chromium content.

    He stated that all chrome surfaces form this chromium oxide as soon as air hits it,and there is no way around it other than frequent use,clean and polished.Further added that chrome is highly reactive to oxygen and this oxide forms in a flash but will completely cover the surface if allowed to sit.
    CLP on a tight fitting patch is likely just removing some of the oxide layer through a polishing action.

    Further added thats why even a spotlessly cleaned and oiled hard chrome bore will put color on a patch(some assume its simply copper/lead/carbon gas fouling) after a short time of sitting.

    Now Im not a a metallurgist or chemist so I can't confirm any of it,but it was interesting.
    Last edited by Blankwaffe; 08-10-13 at 20:57. Reason: correction
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blankwaffe View Post
    As a FYI for those that are interested.

    Took one of the affected AR's I mentioned previously to the most respected gunsmiths in my area and had him look at the bore and the fouled greenish/brown patches I pulled thru the bore.First off, he said the bore looked fine but wasn't broken in yet.Said the bore surface would lap in thru use and become more polished.

    He said that it was most likely chromium oxide that naturally forms on chrome surfaces from exposure to oxygen.Visually I would not see it on the surface beyond maybe a dull finish but will put dark gray/green on a patch if polished.

    The chrome oxide is unaffected by most environmental conditions and chemicals and once formed on hard chrome acts as a nearly impenetrable barrier for the surface.This is why chrome is used in so many applications as a tough barrier coating.Stainless steel behaves in the same way due to chromium content.

    He stated that all chrome surfaces form this chromium oxide as soon as air hits it,and there is no way around it other than frequent use,clean and polished.Further added that chrome is highly reactive to oxygen and this oxide forms in a flash but will completely cover the surface if allowed to sit.
    CLP on a tight fitting patch is likely just removing some of the oxide layer through a polishing action.

    Further added thats why even a spotlessly cleaned and oiled hard chrome bore will put color on a patch(some assume its simply copper/lead/carbon gas fouling) after a short time of sitting.

    Now Im not a a metallurgist or chemist so I can't confirm any of it,but it was interesting.
    Okay, so I have a SS barrel, which, going by this, should not have rusted. But it did. So, what caused it to rust aside from moisture and improper storage?
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mauser KAR98K View Post
    Okay, so I have a SS barrel, which, going by this, should not have rusted. But it did. So, what caused it to rust aside from moisture and improper storage?
    Don't know the answer to that.
    Only mention of stainless was what I stated.Reading online the chromium content is what makes the steel stainless,and its tyically only around 18% in gun parts due to the needed robustness of the part,again from what I read briefly.....so stainless steel is not corrosion proof.So I'd say the percentage of chromium content in the steel will be what dictates just how stainless the steel is....my uneducated guess is hard chrome is a completely different animal as its applied in pure state over the steel as a coating,not a small part of the chemical makeup of the steel.

    That said Ive got some Kimbers that the stainless barrels rust freckle like crazy but none of the other parts do.I have some high end stainless steel butcher knives that are the same way,but man they take a razor edge and hold it,so I bet the carbon content is high with only enough chromium content to prevent actual staining of the surfaces.So,I guess its a safe bet to say stainless steel used in some gun parts is what should be considered corrosion resistant.

    There are also plenty of examples online of pitted and damaged hard chrome plated bores too...so I would say there isn't anything out there thats completely fool proof.

    Like Mastifhound stated above,more frequent PM is the only correct answer.I had moved to a 30-90 day routine due to the size of my collection and time constraints,and wasn't having any issues until recently.This is the first time Ive ever had any issues in my 47 years,so Im putting my collection back into the weekly rotation schedule I used previously.The guns that don't see alot of use will be coated with RIG Rag/grease as I did in the past as well. Im also getting my lockers 2' off the floor on stands to eliminate any condensation issues coming up from the floor.
    That all combined with my improved dehumidified environment I should not see any further issues...I hope.
    Last edited by Blankwaffe; 08-10-13 at 23:37. Reason: ETA
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mauser KAR98K View Post
    Okay, so I have a SS barrel, which, going by this, should not have rusted. But it did. So, what caused it to rust aside from moisture and improper storage?
    Three days and thirty-eight posts over two pages and you have to ask this question?

    You sprayed stupid shit on it and compromised the passive layer on the steel...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mauser KAR98K View Post
    Quick update.

    Two culprits. The pelcan case and cleaning the weapon and casing in high humidity. Wrong cleaning agent, which has been switched yet again. Another possible culprit was possibly when i had it painted during the winter, there was a lot of moisture in the air.

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