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Industry Professional/Moderator
Last time I talked to him I think he was using straight thumb, support hand in the "extended" position, not fully straightened. I don't think that thumb over bore or thumb parallel to bore is all that important to the physical interaction with the fore-end, and there might be some advantage of a straight thumb in regard to gross aiming, and it carries over from the pistol.Originally Posted by vicious_cb
Late Senior Member
Am I missing something, or do we (a) have two different conversations going on here, (b) one of which should probably involve the one guy (MAC) who has yet to really weigh-in? Not looking to ruffle any feathers, but at some point we're going to start spinning in circles here, and that is unlikely to serve anyone well.
AC
Stand your ground; don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here. -- Captain John Parker, Lexington, 1775.
Industry Professional/Moderator
Not sure if everyone is tracking, but the "MAC" being discussed is the "Military Arms Channel", and I have no idea if the author is the sole author there.
Regardless, I'm going to change the title to try to cut confusion.
Senior Member
Comparing MAC to Nutnfancy was pretty insulting. I have been following his channel for a long while now and he makes some very good, and educational videos. I truly respect his opinions on things, and he's a vocal member of the M4C community. I think he digs into some solid points in his article that many guys, especially on here are afraid to discuss. People don't like admitting they do something because they saw Costa or Travis Haley do it. Maybe we should let MAC tell you himself?
98% Sarcastic. 100% Overthinking things and making up reasons for buying a new firearm.
Senior Member
I concur. MAC does well in his reviews and in the 2A fight earlier this year, he did a great service to our cause with his political-themed videos. Regarding his rant/article, I like how he disputes some "sacred cows". Open and respectful debate is always a wonderful thing, even if it's revisiting a topic. I may disagree due to my "experience" showing that the c-clamp grip is useful, but that doesn't mean I don't still consider MAC a positive influence in the community. Like I said in my first post in the thread, separate the man from his ideas and debate the idea itself.
On a side note, Nutnfancy has my respect because he's a retired USAF Lt Col and he honestly tries to give out good advice and support the firearm community. His success is debatable, and in my opinion, he doesn't do a great job in his videos. But he still has my respect for his service and for trying. I can tell you that if I made videos, I'd probably be a bumbling mess that would have to rely in creative editing and dozens of takes to accomplish anything, and even then I most likely wouldn't have great insights that aren't plagiarized from SMEs who shoot more in a month than I've shot in my life.
Last edited by Koshinn; 10-07-13 at 19:19.
"I never learned from a man who agreed with me." Robert A. Heinlein
Senior Member
I didn't quite catch that subtle difference since its a bit difficult to see on his drills which are mostly from the right hand side perspective. Irregardless of the exact hand and finger positioning on the fore end, from the almost complete forearm rollover that Costa does or more the traditional bent elbow that LAV uses, it seems the article is against is putting the support hand further out on the handguard and getting a more aggressive grip vs using the old GI method of simply resting the gun in your support hand on or close to the magwell.
No, my intent was simply asking if we should disregard what MAC says about "serious shooting" like some other youtube channels. As I said before I like his reviews which are very informative and insightful giving the viewer a very good idea the product short of actually having it your hands.
As someone stated before the things you put out will directly affect your credibility when it comes to things like talking about defensive shooting or what the merits of a firearm for serious use are if you come off as not knowledgeable or saying things that just don't make sense. I mean if someone like Haley or Costa started saying that we should all be shooting our pistols upside down with our pinky finger, wouldn't we all go "uh WTF!?" and pretty much stop listening to anything they say?
Last edited by vicious_cb; 10-07-13 at 20:02.
Senior Member
They actually do that you know.
For demonstrations only, but still.
"I never learned from a man who agreed with me." Robert A. Heinlein
Moderator
Just to make all of this clear as mud......
Vicious_cb, you are talking about this guy:
https://www.m4carbine.net/member.php?u=44124
In your original post, correct?
Industry Professional
Apart from all the other things mentioned, in situations where either a thumb forward or c-clamp grip is most advantageous and likely to be employed (I'm a thumb forward guy), it is unlikely that there will be a leisurely opportunity to be shooting video.
Duane Liptak, Jr.
Executive Vice President
Magpul Industries
info@magpulcore.com
This is a personal account linked to a personal e-mail. Company affiliation and titles are provided purely for transparency requirements of the host site. Although factual company information may be shared through this account, any opinions expressed are solely those of the account holder, and not necessarily those of Magpul Industries or subsidiaries.
Senior Member
Yes that is correct. Would you like me to send him a PM informing him of this thread so he can better explain the article?
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