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Thread: Everyjoe-America’s Soldiers Deserve a Better Rifle

  1. #21
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    I care more about getting a better ruck and armor solution and some new uniforms than I care about getting new rifles. Our m4's are beat up and may not be on the cutting edge but they work. Our rucks, iotv's and kdh plate carriers, and UCP uniforms are the big stinking turds in the room when it comes to an infantryman equipment. Hell I'd rather see them bring all line infantry companies up to date with some pvs-15 nods before we buy new rifles.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fjallhrafn View Post
    The M4 is the rifle the Army deserves, but not the one it needs.

    Sorry, couldn't help it.
    If you'd made an equivalent remark about the USMC, you'd get a lot of flaming from a group who are their own biggest fans. (Ex)Army soldiers are more humble.
    Last edited by GunBugBit; 05-07-14 at 10:43.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by FireandFlames View Post
    I care more about getting a better ruck and armor solution and some new uniforms than I care about getting new rifles. Our m4's are beat up and may not be on the cutting edge but they work. Our rucks, iotv's and kdh plate carriers, and UCP uniforms are the big stinking turds in the room when it comes to an infantryman equipment. Hell I'd rather see them bring all line infantry companies up to date with some pvs-15 nods before we buy new rifles.
    Completely agreed.


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  4. #24
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    AS A MARINE I DISAGREE GunBugBit, Just kidding. Marines are more indoctrinated and proud of it, to a point, but we can also take jokes, you just have to dumb them down. However the article is an opinion not a study. Does adding a Piston make a AR better? no. Does changing the whole platform work? not really. The AR platform is one of the most versatile platforms around, and because of that you will see it on the battlefield in some form or another on any foreseeable battlefield of the future. The reports from Afghanistan have already been questioned. The Army/DOD can do certain things to help the longevity of the platform but won't because it costs too much money, I can think of slipping Hoppe's 9 cleaner into the Armory to clean my weapon when all that they would allow was CLP, and Slip2000 and others found its way on to the range I coached Marines at quite a bit. These are little things but have proven themselves over time.
    I perfer black coffee in the morning, bourbon in evenings and spending money on sh*t I probably don't need.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hank6046 View Post
    AS A MARINE I DISAGREE GunBugBit, Just kidding. Marines are more indoctrinated and proud of it, to a point, but we can also take jokes, you just have to dumb them down. However the article is an opinion not a study. Does adding a Piston make a AR better? no. Does changing the whole platform work? not really. The AR platform is one of the most versatile platforms around, and because of that you will see it on the battlefield in some form or another on any foreseeable battlefield of the future. The reports from Afghanistan have already been questioned. The Army/DOD can do certain things to help the longevity of the platform but won't because it costs too much money, I can think of slipping Hoppe's 9 cleaner into the Armory to clean my weapon when all that they would allow was CLP, and Slip2000 and others found its way on to the range I coached Marines at quite a bit. These are little things but have proven themselves over time.
    The irony (of your true statement) is that the O and M funding is actually less then an incremental (or spiral ) upgrade to the weapons. Freefloat all the uppers as a start, multiple barrels/lower allow guys (and gals) to adjust based on the mission.
    Winning may not be everything, but the endorsements are better.

  6. #26
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    It seems to me that folks further up the chain have very different view points, which as others have noted seem to be based on politics rather than straight logic and grunt-level input.

    One would think that at this point in our Military's history, that this could have been ironed out.

    Plus, although the article slams the M16/M4, I did not notice any suggestions as to what would be better. I have read many veterans and active duty folks say that their rifles/carbines are actually really good, but it also seems that opinions vary based on what they are asked to do with their given equipment.

    Street fighting in Iraq, as I have read, showed that M4s/M16s were fine. But the longer-range engagements in Afghanistan seemed to point to a need for longer range and better optics.
    Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus (519 BC – 430 BC) Power should only be given to those that want it least.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by GunBugBit View Post
    If you'd made an equivalent remark about the USMC, you'd get a lot of flaming from a group who are their own biggest fans. (Ex)Army soldiers are more humble.
    Or we could just not start a bunch of inter-service nonsense, thank you very much. That's not a hint.

    That line of discussion is now over.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&P15T View Post
    It seems to me that folks further up the chain have very different view points, which as others have noted seem to be based on politics rather than straight logic and grunt-level input.

    One would think that at this point in our Military's history, that this could have been ironed out.

    Plus, although the article slams the M16/M4, I did not notice any suggestions as to what would be better. I have read many veterans and active duty folks say that their rifles/carbines are actually really good, but it also seems that opinions vary based on what they are asked to do with their given equipment.

    Street fighting in Iraq, as I have read, showed that M4s/M16s were fine. But the longer-range engagements in Afghanistan seemed to point to a need for longer range and better optics.
    In the comments he just kept saying come back and read my next article. Curious to see what his new and improved is.
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  9. #29
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    I was just in Afghanistan (2013) and the last issue I had was due to my m4.

    More/better lube for the 50's.

    Iotvs suck. Most of us pulled all the soft armor out and used them like a plate carrier. Would have been great to just issue a good plate carrier.

    Better boots.

    Max pro 2 with their Isis suspension would have been a HUGE upgrade compared to the regular max pro with a solid axle rear.

    Any improvements for the individual carbine can be relatively cheap and hugely increase the potential of the m4. Firstly get something other than m855. The afghans where 110 pounds of unarmored human. Something to kill that better would have been great. As far as reliability: Mike pannone wrote an article where he observed 80% of stoppages are mag or worn out springs related. The other 20% of stoppages where solved by a heavier buffer, blue spring co spring, and extractor upgrades.

    So mk318 ammo, pmags, and $100 in parts per rifle would probably get that 90%+ improvement.

  10. #30
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    Next part is up, if anyone cares:

    http://www.everyjoe.com/2014/05/12/p...quate-weapons/
    Montrala

    I'm sponsored competition shooter representing Heckler&Koch, Kahles, Hornady and Typhoon Defence brands in Poland, so I can be biased

    http://montrala.blogspot.com

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