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Thread: Hodge Defense--Best Carbine money can buy?

  1. #181
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    Somebody asked this before and I don't recall it being answered...

    Are these unique uppers and lowers fully compatible with all other uppers/lowers that are already out there?

  2. #182
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    I don't know Jim Hodge personally, but as previously stated his name is held in high regard in the industry. Other people whose opinions are also held in high regard have nothing but positive things to say about the rifles he builds. That alone, for me, makes his products worth an honest look. Specs aren't everything, and I wouldn't be quick to disregard any product without first hand experience. Besides, there's always room for more quality products in the industry. It's what keeps it moving forward and driving innovation. If years ago everyone said "why do we need BCM, or Noveske when _______ already exists" we would have missed out on a lot of great innovations and baseline quality improvement.
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  3. #183
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    Had a nice chat with Jim yesterday. He is what you would call a Professional Weaponizer. Meaning he gets paid to build guns that good people use to shoot bad people in the face. He has consulted for many of the main players in the industry and is friends with all the other ones. While many of the items on THIS AR are COTS, he chose them for a reason. The biggest difference is that he has made some dimensional changes to the receivers. This is the hard part for someone to explain as you don't want to give away your secrets to your competitors. I understand and respect that. If you are a prospective buyer and want to know all the details, then this might not be the AR for you.

    Cost. So everyone is excited about the cost. What many fail to realize is that Jim has Distributors and dealers in the system. Each one of them is going to want to make money (crazy I know). If Jim sold this gun direct to the consumer, it would be cheaper, but his reach into the AR community would be shallow at best.

    I look forward to seeing Jim's future offerings and believe that we will be hearing more from him in the future.



    C4

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMS951 View Post
    I disagree
    Asking questions is fine. What I find unprofessional is the continual harassment and framing questions in a way meant to cast doubt on the character of the person being interrogated. That's not fact finding, that's a witch hunt.

    Just look at the difference between how you disagreed with me and how DWood "disagrees" with SMGLee. Your post states your position without being disrespectful and invites dialogue. It questions my position on the matter, not my integrity. On the other hand, DWood attacks the integrity of SMGLee, a well respected member who has done nothing to deserve such treatment.

    I would like to know more details about the Hodge rifle myself. It promises to be the Kimber or Dakota of the AR world and I hope it delivers. (I also feel KAC, with their level of attention to detail, has achieved the same status.) But all the insinuation that SMGLee has some sort of agenda or is getting a free pass to shill is ridiculous and in this case, is unethical and unprofessional. I want to know more about how Hodge is making a better AR. As someone who has always aspired to finer firearms than I could afford, I'm excited and want to hear more from Chen and Jim
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  5. #185
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    The uppers and lowers will fit fine on non-Hodge mates, and in fact you can buy Hodge uppers separately to drop onto your lower.
    IAW site rules, I work for Magpul Industries

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  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by fixit69 View Post
    Wow.

    Shots of preparation H all around. And some saline solution for all the sandy vagina.

    Jesus guys, let this one shake out. Two people on this whole forum have access to one of these rifles. At least stay judgement, good or bad, till they are vetted a little more. I am interested in innovation and want to see how this goes.

    But I own a piston AR too so I am an outcast leper...
    Therein lies the rub. We have a 19 page thread on "AR15 prices falling like bricks." Now we have a thread about a $2K+ carbine and a naturally circumspect audience is being told how great it is and that it compares to a Wilson 1911. Well a Wilson 1911 has over a quarter century of proven performance. As was pointed out, not even the Wilson AR has successfully lived up to that standard.

    I don't think anyone here is saying this is a bad AR. We're attempting to assess value for our money. We're attempting to quantify the value to the end user. One thing a high dollar Wilson 1911 has is resale value. How will we the prospective buyer convince 2nd hand buyers of this value? We can't quantify that it was assembled with a special secret sauce and is therefore worth the extra money.

    What some of us are trying to say is that the proprietor seems to have some proprietary manufacturing or assembly of this AR that make it worth the extra coin, but that it's proprietary and can't be quantified other than "feel". Well without a no questions asked money back guarantee, many of us can't afford to drop over $2K on something we haven't felt and are being asked for our trust.

    Market penetration depends on far more than a quality product. When BCM has a "Filthy 14" out there that has over 40K rounds downrange, that is a tangible we can sell to ourselves, our spouses and whomever we may wish to resell to in the future. I have zero disrespect for anyone posting here, but this thread will not achieve the intended effect of getting more Hodge Defense carbines on the range in the hands of M4C members in it's current form.

    If it's worth every penny of it's asking price, it should be fairly easy to quantify what makes it worth that price.
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  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by FIGJAM View Post
    Stupid question. It's a better trigger. ...Now go ahead and use that 6th post to attempt a comeback, Squirt.
    Of course it's a better trigger...

    The main theme of the OP was that you can't build a better rifle for $2k.

  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Mamma View Post
    I don't know Jim and have never handled one of his products.

    But what is in bold is very important. It's one thing that very few, if any, other AR manufacturers can claim. I am of course assuming that the "one person" is always the same person and is Jim Hodge. If I were to buy one of his guns, that would be one of the top reasons why (maybe the top reason).

    I have bought guns which were put together like crap, and they came from the top names in the business. The problem with guns (and many other products) is that you never know who actually put yours together.

    I'm one of those guys that believes if you give identical AR parts to a few different guys (and told them to build a gun), the guns would most likely come out very different. I think the person building the AR makes a big difference. It's one of the reasons why I generally build my own now. I don't want to roll the dice and hope I get a good gun simply based on a list of parts and specs.

    Jim, thank you for posting in this thread. I hope you continue to do so.

    Joe Mamma
    These are the very same reasons I would buy one as well.

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by glocktogo View Post
    Therein lies the rub. We have a 19 page thread on "AR15 prices falling like bricks." Now we have a thread about a $2K+ carbine and a naturally circumspect audience is being told how great it is and that it compares to a Wilson 1911. Well a Wilson 1911 has over a quarter century of proven performance. As was pointed out, not even the Wilson AR has successfully lived up to that standard.


    If it's worth every penny of it's asking price, it should be fairly easy to quantify what makes it worth that price.
    What makes a Ferrari worth the asking price or for that matter a Rolex or any high dollar dollar items. There will always be an alternative that can replicate the performance of the more expensive items.. That is the market, but for those that are looking to buy a rifle that is put together by a master gun builder with attention to detail that is unheard of..... You have the ticket with Hodge.. And for those that can't justify the price, the market bears plenty of great offerings.

    I did an impromptu test this morning, I pitted one of my carbine against the Hodege Defense rifle to demonstrate the receiver fitting. This test really does NOT prove anything other than to show the Hodge spec'ed forging that make the receiver fit like a glove(The HDSI upper will retrofit any mil-spec lower). It is these little things that you will notice in the Hodge rifle.




    Its not a professionally done video, basically did this with my iPhone...I will have more detail pictures later this afternoon.

    I host all of the Alias training instructors in Southern California for that past five years(started with Grey Group), I have basically shot with all of the named instructors at least once if not more. I have sent a few rounds against a paper target in my past, so I have seen plenty of rifles and pistol through my hands. However, this Hodge rifle impressed me to no ends. As I will continue to update the status of my ownership with the next upcoming class which is Pat McNamara Rifle TAPS in a few weeks.

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by C4IGrant View Post
    If you are a prospective buyer and want to know all the details, then this might not be the AR for you.

    Out of multiple insane things I read in this thread this one takes the cake, Grant. I have three ARs and all of them are in 2K range; in fact, two MSTN ones have uppers alone approaching that price. However, besides knowing that a master craftsman put them together, I know exactly why they cost what they do cost.

    On a subject, fit, finish and proprietary dimensions of a 200-400 yard range rifle that shoots 5.56 present next to zero interest to me. Competent assembly does, but there is a translational benefit to that; I've not heard much about that here.

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