Scalarworks Micro mount.

[Koshinn]

You had LAV test these right?

For some reason that's in my head.

[Scalarworks]

You had LAV test these right?

LAV contacted us shortly after we announced the release of the LDM/Micro, expressing interest in our mount. We were happy to send him a couple for evaluation, which he's had for a little over 2 weeks now.

He's posted several pics of the Low Drag Mount on one of his uppers and on one of his rifles, as well as with his new Aimpoint Micro T-2 on his Facebook timeline.

Keep an eye on LAV's and Scalarwork's facebook pages for more updates.

[Hochsitz]

Jerry, have you tried shooting with and without the T1 on your rifle? The T1 is a great little sight, but the ones I've looked through have a slight optical offset that is barely noticeable unless you hold it up against a long straight line like a wire between two telephone poles. It's not really an issue for the T1, except when you're cowitnessed with irons that are sighted to your dot. Everything works great until you remove the T1. That slight offset is no longer there and the result is your (or I should I say my) irons point at a different spot. It's been a while since I noticed it and just concluded that if my T1 battery went dead I would leave it on and shoot with irons (no change). My memory is that it was enough to miss a 100 yard target. Of course in the unlikely event the T1 glass breaks (it literally takes an explosion to do this right?) you will suffer the offset no matter what.

Since you have the QD mount and plan to use it I thought you would be in a great position to verify this for us (me) to see if you experience the same thing. Again, not criticizing the sight or the mount, they are great products, just want folks to be aware of the limitations since this is a SHTF kind of product.

[jerrysimons]

The T1/H1 are proven products but I suppose the possibility of a slight POA shift due to paralax with zered irons viewed through the glass is there. I am interested to test the theory and curious what SMEs have to say about this phenomenon. As far as paralax goes I would be more concerned about shifting point of aim simply by viewing the dot all the way at the edge of the glass. On this front the T2 is supposed to be an improvement over the T1.

In any event you are dead in the water if your glass fogs without QD mounts and you can't see your irons, which is a common occurrence in various weather conditions like rain and/or tempurature fluctuations. You could zero your irons without RDS attached then zero the RDS separately but I am not sure it is a big enough problem to worry about. You got me thinking though. Now I want to test the POA shift in both ways, irons zeroed viewed through RDS then RDS removed, zeroed irons then with RDS attached: Measure POA/POI shift.

[Scalarworks]

The T1 is a great little sight, but the ones I've looked through have a slight optical offset

All optical devices with a curved lens exhibit some optical distortion. Even a great quality reflex sight like the Aimpoint Micro does to a small degree.

That distortion will affect everything viewed through the sight, including your front sight and the target. So when you're zeroing your irons while looking through your red dot you're effectively doing so with the distortion pre-applied to both.

Assuming your red dot and irons are co-witnessed, any visual shift should be equal; if you remove your optic you will be eliminating the same amount of optical shift from both the target and your front sight post.

[jerrysimons]

All optical devices with a curved lens exhibit some optical distortion. Even a great quality reflex sight like the Aimpoint Micro does to a small degree.

That distortion will affect everything viewed through the sight, including your front sight and the target. So when you're zeroing your irons while looking through your red dot you're effectively doing so with the distortion pre-applied to both.

Assuming your red dot and irons are co-witnessed, any visual shift should be equal; if you remove your optic you will be eliminating the same amount of optical shift from both the target and your front sight post.

What does this mean for zeroed irons? Since the target is also affected?

[JoshNC]

Looks really nice. Would like to see a low-pro model for use on 55x, FNC, mp5, and others requiring a lower mount. And I'll add my support for a 30 and 34mm line of one-piece optic mounts.

[Hochsitz]

Assuming your red dot and irons are co-witnessed, any visual shift should be equal; if you remove your optic you will be eliminating the same amount of optical shift from both the target and your front sight post.

I wholeheartedly agree that in theory it should work this way. For some reason it didn't for me. Either because I'm crazy or some phenomenon we don't have a name for yet. It's almost as if it not only shifts the image and front sight but the perspective of the two, as if you had shifted your eye to the side but were still looking through the rear sight.

Jerry I can't wait to hear if you experience the same thing. I know it sounds strange so I'm dying to see if someone else can verify the behavior. I could try to take a picture but would need a pinhole in front of my lens to have a hope of getting everything in focus at once (rear sight, front sight, target). Maybe I'll give that a shot tomorrow when it's light out.

[Hochsitz]

Okay Guys, I couldn't wait. I put my phone in a vise and positioned a long drill bit a couple feet in front of it so it aligns under a 1.5 inch black square target on my garage door 20 feet away. I made a nice little video bringing a T1 between the camera and drill bit and you could easily see the relationship shifting the position of the target but not the drill bit. Since I didn't feel like posting the video to YouTube I just grabbed some screen shots with and without the T1 and made a .jpg which is attached here. I didn't bother using something for a rear sight because the phone camera was rigidly mounted. The target appears to shift a little less than 3/4" which when extrapolated to 100 yards would be around 10 MOA. As Jerry stated, you could zero your irons without the T1 then install the T1 but that might be a little distracting using a cowitnessed sight that looks like it's not properly cowitnessed. Hope someone can verify this with live fire for us. T1 Experiment.jpg

[tonyxcom]

I don't know if this is the same phenomenon, but one of the things I have always heard with red dots is that you can use them with both eyes open and the front lens cover closed so you aren't actually looking through the glass.

That part we all know works. So me and my brother tried it one day in the desert, but on a target about 175-200y away.

Our POI was about 10 feet to the right!

Back on topic. I bought one of the PA Arms Advanced Micro/Scalarworks Combos (old Larue mount and PA dot to go on a beater) and received it today. Was planning on testing the RTZ with my T1 at the range tomorrow but I was sent an absolute co-witness mount instead of the lower 1/3 I wanted.

The mount is really nice and the clicks of the knob were much firmer than I was expecting. I bet that low drag knob would work great to make screws on keymod accessories more QDish! You heard it here first!