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Thread: I am still a little confused about trusts...

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by eodinert View Post
    You have a big emotional investment in this. Do you sell trusts?
    You are mistaken. I have no investment at all in this debate. My only interest is in pointing out the fallacy of depending on a trust prepared by someone who does not practice trust and estate law. But hey, they're your toys, not mine. Do what you want.

    I do not, and have never, sold/prepared/drafted or otherwise helped someone with a trust, because I know that I'm not qualified to draft one.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPB View Post
    Is this true? I thought that you had to put the item you are applying for the stamp for on the Schedule A for submission with the Trust and Form 1.
    This is the only version of my Sched A that the ATF has ever seen:



    It's not that I'm "hiding" anything or wearing my tin foil hat and don't want to be in a list. The only items in my trust are NFA firearms, and since the ATF approved them all, they know what exists. It's simply a matter of I don't feel like scanning a new copy for EForms, or for the copy I email to a dealer. There's zero requirement to send the ATF an updated copy, or to list the item in question. I have >20 stamps, all approved with the above Schedule A.

    Now, I do keep an updated copy at home with the original trust. Listing the item on the Schedule A doesn't grant ownership. The fact that I listed Lastname Living Trust on my F1/F4 is why the trust owns the item. The Sched is nothing more than a local inventory sheet and should make it easier for successor trustees and/or beneficiaries to know what property the trust holds.

    In most cases, something has to be on the Sched A, as a trust needs to be funded to be valid. However, there are lots of trusts out there where something ($1, $10, a lower, etc) is "hard coded" into the trust language as the initial funding property, and the Sched A is blank. The ATF approves forms every day that have a blank Sched A...you just have to include a copy of it if the trust uses one, whether it's blank or has multiple items.

  3. #33
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    Thats what I've been reading lately. ^^

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigWaylon View Post
    . The ATF approves forms every day that have a blank Sched A...you just have to include a copy of it if the trust uses one, whether it's blank or has multiple items.
    Now mine has a Schedule 1, which I assume doesn't matter what is called since it does the same thing.

    Now no where in the trust does it mention a Schedule 1 list, so does that mean I don't have to include it?? My dealer told me when we fill out the Form 4 , not to worry about Property list, the ATF didn't care about it. ( I don't know , this is all new to me )
    The price of liberty is, always has been, and always will be blood: The person who is not willing to die for his liberty has already lost it to the first scoundrel who is willing to risk dying to violate that person's liberty! Are you free?
    --- Andrew Ford

  5. #35
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    I put:

    1. One Dollar Federal Reserve Note, Ser# xxxxxxxxx

    Just in case I need to have it engraved... :-)

    Rmpl
    "Our destruction... will be from another quarter. From the inattention of the people to the concerns of their government, from their carelessness and negligence..."
    ...Daniel Webster, June 1, 1837

  6. #36
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    So is the conclusion that it depends on the state whether to have a blank or filled Schedule A?

  7. #37
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    Wow, thanks for clearing this up for me. I was kind of sweating the Sched A stuff.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrvip27 View Post
    So is the conclusion that it depends on the state whether to have a blank or filled Schedule A?
    Do not use a form trust. Use a NFA attorney, I cannot believe how much bad information gets circulated about this topic. Just because you don't have a problem getting your stamps does not mean you haven't made some serious legal mistakes.

    I have seen so many problems that come up just from using willmaker alone that I am shocked someone would use it to ale a trust that could potentially subject them to federal criminal penalties. Additionally, many of the form trusts I have see. Offered are flat out terrible, some of them I have even reported to the state bar of texas for the unauthorized practice of law.

    Don't be lazy with this stuff.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmoney View Post
    Do not use a form trust. Use a NFA attorney, I cannot believe how much bad information gets circulated about this topic. Just because you don't have a problem getting your stamps does not mean you haven't made some serious legal mistakes.

    I have seen so many problems that come up just from using willmaker alone that I am shocked someone would use it to ale a trust that could potentially subject them to federal criminal penalties. Additionally, many of the form trusts I have see. Offered are flat out terrible, some of them I have even reported to the state bar of texas for the unauthorized practice of law.u

    Don't be lazy with this stuff.
    What does this have to do with your Sched A?

  10. #40
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    Ok , so what are the wrong points of a form trust?

    What legal mistakes are you referring to?

    Lots of people say how bad they are, but no one points out the actual problem.

    Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
    The price of liberty is, always has been, and always will be blood: The person who is not willing to die for his liberty has already lost it to the first scoundrel who is willing to risk dying to violate that person's liberty! Are you free?
    --- Andrew Ford

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