This is just painful to look at: Beretta APX

[CatSnipah]

Mags are a high margin, low cost, accessory. I'm sure it was more of a business decision than anything else. But I definitely agree, it would have been a draw for current M9/M92 owners.

Good point regarding mags margins.

However, one of the reasons I'm going to eventually add a VP9 is the plethora of P30 mags I already have.

Well, in fairness, that's more of a perk than a decision-driver.

[ramairthree]

Lots of discussion-
yes Beretta needs a modern, common style polymer pistol on the market.

I do not think this is it.

92 mag compatibility would be smart. Strangely, I think it would be even smarter if it took Glock mags.

It has that "90-two" and CX4 looks over function styling look to it.

I will make some predictions:

The price point will not be at all competitive with buying a new Glock.

Once people get a hold of the pistol- it will be determined that the design is all looks and style and no real shooters had been brought in to address ergonomics. I will be happy if this is proven wrong.

The magazines will not be 92 compatible bodies, and will MSRP at twice that of Glock magazines.

The trigger will suck.

Sights, extended mag releases, extended mag bases will be proprietary little items with limited production just like CX4 parts, etc.

The revolutionary caliber change, compatibility, etc. will fall flat on its face. They are entering a declining .40 market that has less interest in that caliber every day. R&D and production for this market is even later than their unneeded 96A1 development.

Given the pistol comes out with no production/reliability issues and shoots great-
the market share is going to be on par with the PX4 or 9000 and holsters, aftermarket accessories, etc. is going to be a pain in the ass.

This would be like Chevy coming out with a smaller, lighter 2+2 sports couple than the Camaro to more directly compete with the Mustang. But they already have the Camaro. They also have the Vette. And the SS. And there are several other small, light 2+2 coupes out there. And the Mustang market share is huge.

An offering in this mode from them needs SOMETHING.

Something radical.

The point about using Glock mags I have to admit makes more sense than 92 mags.

If this pistol had double strike capability, no special tool to take down, no trigger squeeze to disassemble, common sight cuts to glock, glock mag compatibility, equal to or greater than Glock reliability, better accuracy than Glock, and better ergonomics, at a competitive price point, with a great trigger-
the market might sit up and take notice. It would already have a built in aftermarket for mags and sights and address some points people make about Glocks. That is a tall order.

[DreadPirateMoyer]

Lots of discussion-
yes Beretta needs a modern, common style polymer pistol on the market.

I do not think this is it.

92 mag compatibility would be smart. Strangely, I think it would be even smarter if it took Glock mags.

It has that "90-two" and CX4 looks over function styling look to it.

I will make some predictions:

The price point will not be at all competitive with buying a new Glock.

Once people get a hold of the pistol- it will be determined that the design is all looks and style and no real shooters had been brought in to address ergonomics. I will be happy if this is proven wrong.

The magazines will not be 92 compatible bodies, and will MSRP at twice that of Glock magazines.

The trigger will suck.

Sights, extended mag releases, extended mag bases will be proprietary little items with limited production just like CX4 parts, etc.

The revolutionary caliber change, compatibility, etc. will fall flat on its face. They are entering a declining .40 market that has less interest in that caliber every day. R&D and production for this market is even later than their unneeded 96A1 development.

Given the pistol comes out with no production/reliability issues and shoots great-
the market share is going to be on par with the PX4 or 9000 and holsters, aftermarket accessories, etc. is going to be a pain in the ass.

This would be like Chevy coming out with a smaller, lighter 2+2 sports couple than the Camaro to more directly compete with the Mustang. But they already have the Camaro. They also have the Vette. And the SS. And there are several other small, light 2+2 coupes out there. And the Mustang market share is huge.

An offering in this mode from them needs SOMETHING.

Something radical.

The point about using Glock mags I have to admit makes more sense than 92 mags.

If this pistol had double strike capability, no special tool to take down, no trigger squeeze to disassemble, common sight cuts to glock, glock mag compatibility, equal to or greater than Glock reliability, better accuracy than Glock, and better ergonomics, at a competitive price point, with a great trigger-
the market might sit up and take notice. It would already have a built in aftermarket for mags and sights and address some points people make about Glocks. That is a tall order.

Very interesting how much you were able to glean from a picture and short announcement, especially the trigger. I wish I had your powers of insight.

The replies in this thread are astounding.

[Talon167]

It's not that bad... looks like the S&W SV. But, gets a big "Meh" from me...

[RHINOWSO]

Very interesting how much you were able to glean from a picture and short announcement, especially the trigger. I wish I had your powers of insight.

The replies in this thread are astounding.

This.

Then the analogy of guns to cars.

Nice, so much for factual discussion.

[ramairthree]

Very interesting how much you were able to glean from a picture and short announcement, especially the trigger. I wish I had your powers of insight.

The replies in this thread are astounding.

No need to be snarky.

These are predictions.

Predictions that are based on precedents.

I am extrapolating the PX4, 9000, Cougar, ARX, CX4, 90-two, 96A1 experience.

I am a huge Beretta fan.

I stated I will be very happy to be proven wrong.

I have dozens of Beretta pistols and was issued my first one in 1987.

[ramairthree]

This.

Then the analogy of guns to cars.

Nice, so much for factual discussion.

Again, why all the butt hurt over predictions? Each is made based on another Beretta introduced carbine or pistol.

And why butt hurt over an analogy to a very tough market?

How many Berettas have you guys bought?

I think I have 16 9mm or .40 cal pistols and carbines.

This design has the benefit of decades of experience in other polymer framed striker fired pistols.
Just as their ARX did for AR mag carbines.

[QuickStrike]

Those cocking serrations look a bit small imo.

it can only be disassembled when it is disarmed, and that's why a slot on the frame allows the use of a tool to decock it before it can be field-stripped by operating a lever found on the left side of the frame itself, right over the trigger guard.

Me no like.

[brickboy240]

A tool to disassemble it?

...and to think I was not hating its looks and the fact that they did not do something dumb like put a huge winged safety way up on the slide (ala 92F) and then there is this gem.

Why is it that a company that makes some attractive and well thought out shotguns can miss the boat this bad on their handgun designs?

[Parabellum147]

Function over form...but this is not the form we are accustomed to seeing with a Beretta rollmark.