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Thread: What (if any) Are The Downsides of SBR's?

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hmac View Post
    Here is the link to the actual letter. https://www.guntrustlawyer.com/files...tate-lines.pdf
    Where do you think I took the snippet from?

    (I keep that one bookmarked along with a couple others)
    Last edited by BigWaylon; 09-09-15 at 22:23.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hmac View Post
    Yes. If the rifle has a 16 inch-or-longer, it's no longer under the purview of the NFA unless you retain control of the parts that made it an SBR. As discussed above, if you slap a 16 inch upper on it and leave the SBR upper at home, you no longer "retain control" and you're legal out of state. Along those lines, if you want to sell the rifle, you can put the 16 inch upper on it, sell the short barrel and now it's a GCA firearm and you can sell it, loan it, transport it as you could any rifle. IOW, it's no longer an SBR regardless of its status with the NFTR. Now, NFA Branch "recommends" that you notify them by mail that you've taken the short barrel off of it, ostensibly so they can take it off the NFTR, but it isn't required that you do so.

    In fairness to other points of view, some on this forum, at least one person, disagrees with that definition of "retains control". Seems pretty clear to me, however, and apparently the NFA Branch Director agrees.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigWaylon View Post
    In addition to the info above (which includes a snippet of a letter I posted in this topic already), being in the registry doesn't matter near as much as the configuration of the firearm.

    •You can replace the upper with a 16+ upper for hunting where SBRs aren't allowed for hunting
    •You can put on a long upper and cross state lines as you wish
    •You can remove the upper and take the lower across state lines
    •You can remove the upper and sell the lower as a GCA firearm without any additional paperwork (you can also sell the short upper to anybody, as it's up to the buyer to be legal)

    ***this assumes none of the travel/hunting is done with the short upper with you (you can still own it, just not carry it with you)

    When the firearm isn't configured as an NFA firearm, it's simply a firearm with additional engraving.


    The gov has changed the formatting of the FAQ, but it would do you some good to read through all of these: National Firearms Act. (Pay close attention to the number of time recommends is used instead of requires...because there are no statutes to back up a lot of the "laws" you hear people regurgitate online and at gun shops.
    Thanks guys. That makes life a lot easier. Think I need to get some more engraving done....

  3. #53
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    First Thanks to whoever finally let me into this great site and den of inequity. The advantages are many and one day I may get one legally, but for now I refuse to play the government's game. If I'm not mistaken my rights are still being infringed requiring me to complete paperwork and pay taxes for that right. This may include me going with hat in hand making me feel like I'm begging for the right from the high Sheriff of my county. That Sheriff was trained and supervised by me years ago. I like and respect him but I just can't swallow my pride enough to do so. JMO YMMV

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by protector 6062 View Post
    First Thanks to whoever finally let me into this great site and den of inequity. The advantages are many and one day I may get one legally, but for now I refuse to play the government's game. If I'm not mistaken my rights are still being infringed requiring me to complete paperwork and pay taxes for that right. This may include me going with hat in hand making me feel like I'm begging for the right from the high Sheriff of my county. That Sheriff was trained and supervised by me years ago. I like and respect him but I just can't swallow my pride enough to do so. JMO YMMV
    meh. Do it via trust and skip the Sheriff. Same $200, but less hassle. You can stand your ground on your rights being infringed...or you can pay to play and then fight it while owning NFA items. So far, option #2 has proven to be more enjoyable, yet more expensive.

  5. #55
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    I might be out of my lane here.

    But how do you guys retain control of your SBR that is back home in tact? ETA: An example being I doubt you keep the gun with you at all times in state.

    I'd imagine that the safe that houses the entire rifle generally while your at home in state is acceptable to house the upper until you return or lower when you're out of state?

    I may be oversimplifying this. But the circumstances seem clear to me.
    Last edited by BWT; 09-11-15 at 01:34.

  6. #56
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    Retaining control is pretty simple. You are either present to keep control over others who may be present, or, if not present, have secured it in a location that others do not have access to.
    Such as a safe or lockbox that no one else has the combination or key to.

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  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by BWT View Post
    I might be out of my lane here.

    But how do you guys retain control of your SBR that is back home in tact? ETA: An example being I doubt you keep the gun with you at all times in state.

    I'd imagine that the safe that houses the entire rifle generally while your at home in state is acceptable to house the upper until you return or lower when you're out of state?

    I may be oversimplifying this. But the circumstances seem clear to me.
    Simple. All my family members are listed in my trust. They can legally possess it even if I'm gone.
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  8. #58
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    I've no safe. I have only an antique cedar gun case with a locking glass door (skeleton key) that's about 70 years old. If it's in my gun case, in my house, on my property, it's under my control, weather I'm home or not. However, If I get any more NFA items, (and I am hoping to put money down on a suppressor this winter) I'll likely get a trust with the whole family on it.
    Last edited by daddyusmaximus; 09-11-15 at 11:03.
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  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by daddyusmaximus View Post
    If it's in my gun case, in my house, on my property, it's under my control, weather I'm home or not.
    Except that's the exact opposite of how the ATF answers the question.

    Using your definition of "in control of", you wouldn't be able to travel or hunt with an upper >16" on the registered lower.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigWaylon View Post
    meh. Do it via trust and skip the Sheriff. Same $200, but less hassle. You can stand your ground on your rights being infringed...or you can pay to play and then fight it while owning NFA items. So far, option #2 has proven to be more enjoyable, yet more expensive.
    Thanks BigWaylon ya learnt me something already. I do have an Agriculture business where I hide or lose cows and horses, 2 children who are attorneys, and a large extended family. I never knew this was available. The money is really not a issue but the hat in hand dance galls me. I have the Sheriff's personal phone numbers but really it's the issue of having to ask him for a favor.

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