"Binary Firing System" from Franklin Armory - fire on pull AND on release

[Junkie]

[Noodles]

They say if you pull, put on semi, release it doesn't fire again. The second paragraph says this for the reverse firing one, the third for binary firing.

:\ The "auto" selector position fires in press and release. I thought we were all on the same pages on this.

What I'm wondering is what happens if you press, and want to abort before a release. Does switching to safe/semi while holding down do that, or 'must' you fire another round (save the obvious action of taking the gun out of battery).

[thx997303]

Did you read the atf letter? It covered this.
Yes, switching to semi or safe stops the second round discharge. It's been covered. Of course you would have to move the selector while the trigger was held back.

[buckshot1220]

I don't foresee any good coming of this. It is 2015 and people still have a hard time handling "regular" guns in a safe manner. I personally would pack up and leave the range for the day if someone there were using this.

This has ND written all over it.

[Benito]

Did you read the atf letter? It covered this.
Yes, switching to semi or safe stops the second round discharge. It's been covered. Of course you would have to move the selector while the trigger was held back.

So, if you put it on safe with the trigger held back (assuming you finger doesn't slip off the trigger and fire a round when you don't want it to), what happens when you take it off safe? Will it just fire as the trigger releases? This thing sounds like truly terrible idea.

I don't foresee any good coming of this. It is 2015 and people still have a hard time handling "regular" guns in a safe manner. I personally would pack up and leave the range for the day if someone there were using this.

This has ND written all over it.

Agreed. I wouldn't even trust myself with this thing. There are plenty of amazing triggers out there for every conceivable application, including rapid fire, that aren't ND magnets.

[obiwankenobi]

Curious why no one trusts themselves with this? I've never had a ND/AD and I've been around guns since I was 8 (53 now), the trigger has a normal mode just like any fire control selector today but, has that 3rd position of binary which fires a second shot on release, sort of like double taps?

I think this is a lot safer than the slide fire since you fully grip the weapon and are in control of it rather than letting it bounce off your shoulder to get spray fire.

[MegademiC]

The issue for me, is that if you need to stop for an emergency, you get off the trigger asap, which would fire this if your in followthrough. I could see putting something like this on a gun with the sole use of burning through ammo, but never on a gun I'd use for anything other than that.

Honestly, I just think it's stupid, but to each their own. I used to bump fire and think that's dumb now too, so ymmv.

[AM-15]

This whole trigger concept is way wrong for a rifle platform.
I used to shoot skeet for several years and some shooters opted for release triggers.
Saw many negligent discharges.
On the skeet field the most you have is two loads in the shotgun.
In a rifle with more than two rounds, no not going there.
You may think you have total control but your brain is used to pulling the trigger to fire one round only.
Just saying...

Clarence

[buckshot1220]

Curious why no one trusts themselves with this? I've never had a ND/AD and I've been around guns since I was 8 (53 now), the trigger has a normal mode just like any fire control selector today but, has that 3rd position of binary which fires a second shot on release, sort of like double taps?

I think this is a lot safer than the slide fire since you fully grip the weapon and are in control of it rather than letting it bounce off your shoulder to get spray fire.

My issue is that is that proper safety training promotes keeping your finger OFF the trigger until you are ready to shoot. If you shoot enough, or even just a little, this quickly becomes muscle memory. Keep your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot, remove finger from trigger when finished. If things go awry, such as in a ND or if something in your sight picture jumps out as "no shoot" after your first squeeze, your muscle memory is going to dictate removing your finger from the trigger and in the case of the binary you now have a second round headed to God only knows where (yet to be pinpointed on GoogleMaps!).

Now, take a moment and think about all of the NDs that happen in this country in a given year. Some destroy property, some injure, some kill. If a ND happens in binary mode you just DOUBLED your chances of seriously injuring or killing someone.

Lastly it seems that when the bolt locks back on an empty mag or in the case of clearing a malfunction the ONLY way to keep the second round from igniting after going live again is to put the rifle into semi or safe mode prior to sending the bolt home. Seeing how quickly we train to reload and clear malfs, this is a non-starter for me and I'm sure this will cause issues on ranges.

In all, this trigger seems to carry with it an entirely new manual of arms that most will likely not master. We (collectively) have issues with trying to follow the most basic rules of firearms safety so please excuse me if I do not have any great degree of faith that John Q. Public is going to figure out how to SAFELY run this thing.

[sidewaysil80]

Safety and negligence concerns aside, I have to ask why? What is the point of this? Are there that many instances of someone accidentally shooting someone where a new trigger system is needed to add an additional safety layer? Furthermore, aside from maybe hunters, who here executes a slow steady squeeze and calculated release each time they pull the trigger in a firefight or perceived life/death situation? In other words, muscle memory and the thousands of a second it takes to release a trigger after shooting is much faster than identifying/realizing you don't want to actually shoot what you just shot and acting on how to stop the shot and render the weapon safe.

This seems like a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. Perhaps worse, a way to capitalize off every negligent/accidental shooting and say "our product would have prevent that...".