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Thread: First Post - looking for advice

  1. #1
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    First Post - looking for advice

    A brief intro. I have been in LE for 17 years, but the last year and a half I have been shooting at the local USPSA club just for the extra practice. I have also become more interested in the AR platform. The last time I had one assigned was 2003 and that was a colt m4a1. We still have access to them depening on what we are assigned. Until the last year I had no idea all the options on the AR platform. I started out with a s&w sport, eotech 558 and mbuis to use as a trainer for the work rifles. Our work policy states we can only used issued ammo in an issues weapon and an extra 100 rounds doesn't last long. Next I built my own lower with Anderson receiver, cmmg LPk, magpul ctr stock combined with an upper from PSA. Upper is 16" ss fluted barrel with midwest ind 15" ssk rail. I put a redfield counterstrike on it and have been looking at scopes. Goal is two do a couple 3 gun matches this year. Also added a DDM4V11 just before Christmas. Put some mbuis and an aimpoint pro so far have about 300 rounds of xm193 and 855. I have been lucky that all 3 have been very reliable. Looking for advise on a scope for the PSA ( wish i got the 18"). I will probably upgrade the trigger with a geisselle 3 gun. The DD , I am thinking of getting an ALG. The S&W sport has the best stock trigger and will keep it as a trainer/practice rifle. Anyway , sorry for the long intro just wanted to give a little background. So basically scope for the PSA and opinions or suggestions based on info provided.

    Thank you!

  2. #2
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    Look at the vortex viper pst 1-4 and they also have a new 1-6 model. Those both fit the bill for three gun work. Contact Vortex directly with your LEO credentials and they'll give you a nice discount. Can't beat them for the price and their customer service is awesome.

    Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by silviacrazed View Post
    Look at the vortex viper pst 1-4 and they also have a new 1-6 model. Those both fit the bill for three gun work. Contact Vortex directly with your LEO credentials and they'll give you a nice discount. Can't beat them for the price and their customer service is awesome.

    Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk
    Thank you, I will look at the vortex. A 1-6 would probably work out well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silviacrazed View Post
    Look at the vortex viper pst 1-4 and they also have a new 1-6 model. Those both fit the bill for three gun work. Contact Vortex directly with your LEO credentials and they'll give you a nice discount. Can't beat them for the price and their customer service is awesome.

    Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk
    I agree. Also check out the Accupoint and Accupower. As far as triggers, I would also look at the SSA and G2S. The 3G is fast, but I think I prefer the SSA. The G2S is also a great option and much cheaper.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNW View Post
    I agree. Also check out the Accupoint and Accupower. As far as triggers, I would also look at the SSA and G2S. The 3G is fast, but I think I prefer the SSA. The G2S is also a great option and much cheaper.
    Thank you. exactly what I am looking for. Also, between the 3 rifles the PSA gas key staking is probably ok, but not as well done as others. Thinking of picking up another BCG. The PSA is midlength gas with standard carbine buffer and spring. I have learned a lot from boards like this and putting my lower together. In the past I just shot them as they were where now I am more interested in experimenting. The Daniel Defense, I will leave alone since it seems to be great out of the box. I didn't really need the DD, but got a good deal and I do like having at least one higher end AR. The PSA build, I don't mind trying different things out. Was thinking of boron nitride BCG,BCM, or one of the JP bolt/buffer springs set ups. Any advice about doing this? Will I gain much performance over the standard mid gas, M16 PSA BCG, carbine buffer/spring. At 100 yards, the s&w sport, DDM4V11 and PSA all seem to be capable of good grouping with the better ammo. I seem to be around 1.5 to 3 inches with xm193. With 69 grain sierra the S&w sport seemed to be slightly better, but all were around an inch to 1.5. Currently all three rifles have mil spec triggers with the s&w being the lightest and least gritty.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICEMAN550 View Post
    Thank you. exactly what I am looking for. Also, between the 3 rifles the PSA gas key staking is probably ok, but not as well done as others. Thinking of picking up another BCG. The PSA is midlength gas with standard carbine buffer and spring. I have learned a lot from boards like this and putting my lower together. In the past I just shot them as they were where now I am more interested in experimenting. The Daniel Defense, I will leave alone since it seems to be great out of the box. I didn't really need the DD, but got a good deal and I do like having at least one higher end AR. The PSA build, I don't mind trying different things out. Was thinking of boron nitride BCG,BCM, or one of the JP bolt/buffer springs set ups. Any advice about doing this? Will I gain much performance over the standard mid gas, M16 PSA BCG, carbine buffer/spring. At 100 yards, the s&w sport, DDM4V11 and PSA all seem to be capable of good grouping with the better ammo. I seem to be around 1.5 to 3 inches with xm193. With 69 grain sierra the S&w sport seemed to be slightly better, but all were around an inch to 1.5. Currently all three rifles have mil spec triggers with the s&w being the lightest and least gritty.
    If you're wanting to try another BCG, my advice is to get an NP3 coated full auto BCG from Sionics. If you don't want a coating then get a standard full auto BCG from BCM or DD.

    Another good way to upgrade your rifle is to switch it over to an A5 system and start with an A5H2 buffer.
    Steve

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveL View Post
    If you're wanting to try another BCG, my advice is to get an NP3 coated full auto BCG from Sionics. If you don't want a coating then get a standard full auto BCG from BCM or DD.

    Another good way to upgrade your rifle is to switch it over to an A5 system and start with an A5H2 buffer.
    OK. I will have to do some research on the A5H2 buffer. Is the NP3 as reliable/good quality as a BCM or DD or is it more about ease of cleaning only? Also the G2S trigger is little confusing. The product info ready 2 stage trigger (1st is 2.5#second is 2#. Any two stage trigger that I have tried had a lighter take up and slightly heavier break. I do like the idea of paying $150-160 vs $260 if it was similar quality. Anyway, thanks for the advice. Now I will do some reading!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ICEMAN550 View Post
    OK. I will have to do some research on the A5H2 buffer. Is the NP3 as reliable/good quality as a BCM or DD or is it more about ease of cleaning only? Also the G2S trigger is little confusing. The product info ready 2 stage trigger (1st is 2.5#second is 2#. Any two stage trigger that I have tried had a lighter take up and slightly heavier break. I do like the idea of paying $150-160 vs $260 if it was similar quality. Anyway, thanks for the advice. Now I will do some reading!
    The A5 isn't just a drop in buffer, it's an entirely different system. It utilizes its own buffers, receiver extension (buffer tube) and rifle recoil spring. A5 springs and buffers are not interchangeable with carbine springs and buffers. You can read more about it:

    https://www.m4carbine.net/google.php...1143j199229j10

    As for the Sionics NP3 BCG, it's my opinion that it is equal in quality to BCM or DD, but easier to clean. One of this forum's moderators and most knowledgeable people (Iraqgunz) is affiliated with Sionics and they're putting out good stuff.
    Steve

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveL View Post
    The A5 isn't just a drop in buffer, it's an entirely different system. It utilizes its own buffers, receiver extension (buffer tube) and rifle recoil spring. A5 springs and buffers are not interchangeable with carbine springs and buffers. You can read more about it:

    https://www.m4carbine.net/google.php...1143j199229j10

    As for the Sionics NP3 BCG, it's my opinion that it is equal in quality to BCM or DD, but easier to clean. One of this forum's moderators and most knowledgeable people (Iraqgunz) is affiliated with Sionics and they're putting out good stuff.
    Thank You! I will take a look at the sionic NP3 BCG and the A5 system. I have read many of IRAQGUNS posts and learned alot. BTW, do you agree to leave the DDM4V11 as is besides maybe a trigger upgrade? Above all else with the DD, is that I want it to work reliably if I need it. That would be my primary HD rifle. I keep it simple with th MBUS sights, aimpoint pro and a stremlight tlr-1hl. I a willing to experiment more with the PSA and see what the supposed "SS match grade lead lapped 223 wylde" can do. So far it hasn't really impressed me. I wish I bought the 18" upper, but for now it wil do. I am actually impressed with the s&w sport. The staking is well done and I have run the gun hard. Over 3 days I put 1000 rounds through it. Mostly speer 64 grain gold dots. I did several mag dumps and no FTF or FTE. I know have about 2500 rounds through it shooting speer GD, xm193, m855 and AE223. For a $530 rifle from Bud's, it has exceded my expectations. I think the DD is better. Shoots much smoother and balanced better, but the sport has been more reliable than many of the colt m4's that I have used at work. For the Colt guys, it is likely that I keep my weapons maintained better and use slip2000 vs clp and the smith seems to be overgassed The sport just has the A2 birdcage and people ask what I am shooting. It is much louder than the other rifles.
    Last edited by ICEMAN550; 01-10-16 at 15:10.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICEMAN550 View Post
    Thank You! I will take a look at the sionic NP3 BCG and the A5 system. I have read many of IRAQGUNS posts and learned alot. BTW, do you agree to leave the DDM4V11 as is besides maybe a trigger upgrade? Above all else with the DD, is that I want it to work reliably if I need it. That would be my primary HD rifle. I keep it simple with th MBUS sights, aimpoint pro and a stremlight tlr-1hl. I a willing to experiment more with the PSA and see what the supposed "SS match grade lead lapped 223 wylde" can do. So far it hasn't really impressed me. I wish I bought the 18" upper, but for now it wil do. I am actually impressed with the s&w sport. The staking is well done and I have run the gun hard. Over 3 days I put 1000 rounds through it. Mostly speer 64 grain gold dots. I did several mag dumps and no FTF or FTE. I know have about 2500 rounds through it shooting speer GD, xm193, m855 and AE223. For a $530 rifle from Bud's, it has exceded my expectations. I think the DD is better. Shoots much smoother and balanced better, but the sport has been more reliable than many of the colt m4's that I have used at work. For the Colt guys, it is likely that I keep my weapons maintained better and use slip2000 vs clp and the smith seems to be overgassed The sport just has the A2 birdcage and people ask what I am shooting. It is much louder than the other rifles.
    I feel any rifle will benefit from the A5 system, but since your DD already runs so well it may not be worth messing with. That's up to you to decide.

    Trigger upgrades are nice and there are several good options out there in various price ranges. In the sub $100 realm there is ALG, BCM's new trigger, and the NP3 coated Sionics trigger. I have one of the Sionics triggers and it's quite nice. Make no mistake, it's not a Geissele, but it was a significant upgrade over the stock BCM trigger it replaced. Note that my BCM lower was bought before they started offering their own enhanced trigger. I have no experience with their new trigger, but based on their reputation alone I would be surprised if it wasn't neck and neck with the Sionics. Of course if you want to go all out on a trigger and price is no object then look at Geissele. I only have experience with the SSA and SD-C. I have a lower with an SD-E but haven't been able to use it yet. They have several other options as well and their quality is second to none.

    The A2 birdcage on your Sport shouldn't be any louder than any other muzzle device. In fact, the A2 is generally considered to be among the tamest muzzle devices in terms of concussion and how loud it is to those around you. Brakes are what will rattle their teeth out.

    And to address your original question, I agree with silviacrazed and TNW to look at Vortex and Trijicon, as well as Nightforce, Steiner, Leupold, etc. You never mentioned what you were looking to spend on an optic, but there a multitude of threads regarding low power variable optics in the optics forum and you'll find all the information you need there.
    Last edited by SteveL; 01-10-16 at 17:42.
    Steve

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