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Thread: Accuracy Review: BCM vs Daniel Defense; Battle of the Lightweights!

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballsagna View Post
    Keep in mind, these results are from a single pair of barrels with different muzzle devices. While the results clearly favor the DD barrel in this case, we shouldn't make the assumption that all DD are more accurate than BCM in this barrel class.

    To prove which mfg is more accurate, we would need a test of a much larger sample size, a bench rest, identical muzzle devices vs no muzzle device, etc. But I'm sure no one has the resources and desire to do that on the scale that would qualify as scientific.

    Don't get me wrong, I really appreciate what the OP did here. He proved very convincingly that HIS dd barrel with muzzle device A is more accurate than HIS bcm barrel with muzzle device B. And I think we can HOPE that under the same circumstances and with the same configuration, we would see the same results with identical barrels we might purchase, but we don't know. There just isn't enough data from a single comparison to account for variations in manufacturing.

    It seems like many of us simply look at a test like this and count it as a win for DD. Then down the road we seem to just remember that DD makes more accurate barrels across the board as a matter of fact, without necessarily recalling what led us to that conclusion.

    My $0.02

    Sent while driving, so?
    I'm not saying BCM accuracy is "poor", just that "tests" across forums have been showing inferior accuracy compared to other CL offerings.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by scooter22 View Post
    It's becoming more apparent that BCM barrels are slightly less capable than their top tier competitors.
    I wouldn't say that DD barrel is anything to write home about.

    Plus the BCM is chrome lined and hammer forged. The DD is just a plain old button rifled barrel and will probably have less than half the life of a chrome lined, hammer forged barrel. While the CHF is good for barrel life, it is detrimental to accuracy.

    This isn't really an apples-to-apples comparison.

    I'm not trying to be a dick or a BCM fanboy, just pointing out that these were made with different goals in mind.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by HelloLarry View Post
    I wouldn't say that DD barrel is anything to write home about.

    Plus the BCM is chrome lined and hammer forged. The DD is just a plain old button rifled barrel and will probably have less than half the life of a chrome lined, hammer forged barrel. While the CHF is good for barrel life, it is detrimental to accuracy.

    This isn't really an apples-to-apples comparison.

    I'm not trying to be a dick or a BCM fanboy, just pointing out that these were made with different goals in mind.
    You got that backwards.

    Also, how are the goals different? They're both CL barrels that used 2 different manufacturing processes.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by HelloLarry View Post
    I wouldn't say that DD barrel is anything to write home about.
    With the right load it averaged 1.5moa for 3 groups of ten, with a lightweight barrel.

    Our standards may be different.

    ETA: When Molon tested the Noveske Skinny barrel (similar profile) his results varied from 1.6"-2.12" and averaged 1.8". That was for 8 10-shot groups, using his match hand loads, (which I guarantee are better than mine), and his test was shot from a bench.

    So for the DD to average <1.6", and to have 2 of the 3 groups under 1.2" is pretty darn good.
    Last edited by friendlyfireisnt; 03-18-16 at 23:53.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by friendlyfireisnt View Post
    With the right load it averaged 1.5moa for 3 groups of ten, with a lightweight barrel.

    Our standards may be different.

    ETA: When Molon tested the Noveske Skinny barrel (similar profile) his results varied from 1.6"-2.12" and averaged 1.8". That was for 8 10-shot groups, using his match hand loads, (which I guarantee are better than mine), and his test was shot from a bench.

    So for the DD to average <1.6", and to have 2 of the 3 groups under 1.2" is pretty darn good.
    You hit the nail on the head.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by scooter22 View Post
    Also, how are the goals different? They're both CL barrels that used 2 different manufacturing processes.
    Pardon me, but the OP didn't say the DD was CL.

    In my mind, it should be shooting 1MOA or under to be worth writing home about.

    Molon has a thread on about the Colt SOCOM. Only 1 of 3 groups exceeds an inch but it is still less than MOA (1.02"group while a MOA is 1.047"). That is worth bragging about.

    Excuse me if I still vote "meh" on the DD.
    Last edited by HelloLarry; 03-19-16 at 19:09.

  7. #17
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    Yes, both barrels are chrome lined.

    Comparing a lightweight, chrome lined barrel to a SOCOM profiled barrel isn't exactly apples-to-apples. In fact, I don't know of any tests out there, that show multiple 10-shot groups out of a true lightweight profile barrel, that are sub-MOA.

    However, I have a bit of a Mea Cupla moment here folks. I had somehow transposed some digits when I did my measurements of the DD barrel, using the Nosler handloads.

    Here is the actual target, micrometer measuring outside-to-outside of the largest of the 3 groups:

    image by Photographer Pilot, on Flickr

    That's not a 2.5" group. That's a 1.501" group. That means I totally ****ed the numbers. The average isn't 1.585", it's 1.251".

    That's 1.251" for 3, 10-shot groups, shot prone, off a bipod on a concrete slab.
    Last edited by friendlyfireisnt; 03-19-16 at 20:11.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by friendlyfireisnt View Post
    Yes, both barrels are chrome lined.

    Comparing a lightweight, chrome lined barrel to a SOCOM profiled barrel isn't exactly apples-to-apples. In fact, I don't know of any tests out there, that show multiple 10-shot groups out of a true lightweight profile barrel, that are sub-MOA.

    However, I have a bit of a Mea Cupla moment here folks. I had somehow transposed some digits when I did my measurements of the DD barrel, using the Nosler handloads.

    Here is the actual target, micrometer measuring outside-to-outside of the largest of the 3 groups:

    image by Photographer Pilot, on Flickr

    That's not a 2.5" group. That's a 1.501" group. That means I totally ****ed the numbers. The average isn't 1.585", it's 1.251".

    That's 1.251" for 3, 10-shot groups, shot prone, off a bipod on a concrete slab.
    That is impressive! I thought it looked tighter.

  9. #19
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    Thanks for posting your results. I've always had an Aimpoint PRO on my DDLW, but I'd love to slap a magnified optic on it just to see what our combined capabilities are at distance.

  10. #20
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    This thread, to me, demonstrates how effective a weapon the AR platform is as a weapon and instrument for combat. Anyone on the receiving end of any of those groups would not live to fight another day, that's for sure.

    I appreciate the OP taking the time to conduct his tests and post the results, that was a lot of effort, so thanks.

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