300 AAC for two-legged critters?

[BufordTJustice]

Here are the real world results - from the very Lightfighter thread that you posted. This is the last post on the first page from Jon Consiglio:



Finally, the debate in the LF thread dealt with which had superior terminal performance: the 6.8 SPC or the 300blk. Nobody, and I mean zip, zero, nada, nunca, nadie...suggested that 5.56 is the equal of the 300blk and especially the 110 Tac-Tx. You my friend, are the only person I can find who thinks they are equivalent even when a 9" SBR is used for the 300blk.

I respect Jon. But his data doesn't contradict mine in the slightest. Read closer. Different shots, weights, and distances.

And I've killed a 180lb hog with a 22 WMR to the spinal column. DRT. That doesn't a defensive round make. Most of Jon's shots are spinal column or brain shots. Whereas, I've used the same shot on every hog.

You're obviously not interested in furnishing ANY substantive information on this subject. You're simply regurgitating what other people have anecdotally observed and have made some fairly controversial claims. When you've got some actual first-hand experience, or something else to offer to substantively support your claim, feel free to PM me.

This thread drift is over. You've proven nothing.

[Brahmzy]

There's a big difference between an 11.5 556 rifle and an 8.5 300BLK rifle. The weight, handling, OAL, OAL suppressed are drastically different. Shoot, even my 10.5s handle very, very different than my 8.5 300BLK.
I could personally give a crap about cost, availability etc. I would not have made the decision to get into the caliber if I couldn't afford it.
The 300BLK fills an HD role and potential hunting role - neither of which requires me to dump thousands of rounds a year of specialty-class 300BLK down range.
I have no doubt a 10.5/11.5/12.5 556 rifle could probably get the job done - especially with new, niche SBR-specific rounds coming out from Hornady n such, but those rifles will never offer the same small, pointable package my 8.5 does. Especially if you hang a can off the muzzle.

[Sensei]

Deleted.

[BufordTJustice]

It seems that hog hunting is the standard by which we are now judging terminal performance. Since my career as a doctor taking care of people who have actually been shot doesn't leave much time for hunting pigs, I'm going to rely on the forum membership to get me up to speed. You know, because the several hundred patients, both military and civilian, that I've seen who've been shot with everything from 22LR up to 50 cal. (probably 15% with 5.56 or 7.62x39) isn't enough real world experience.

So, please - post your experience with hogs so that I can unlearn all of the mistakes from residency / fellowship, 10 years as an attending in a Level 1 Trauma center, and 18 months in OIF2/OEF where I see/saw GSW's on a QD basis. Be sure to send some feedback from hogs that were shot behind auto glass, plywood, denim, and steel sheet - I really want to know.

6 years of patrol work in Orlando Florida, taking more calls for service per Deputy/ per shift than either LAPD or NYPD by a large margin. I saw multiple gunshot wounds per shift. Hell, I'd go from call to call with multiple GSW injuries at each call. Treated a few on fellow LEOs in the field from blow out kits. We're not that far off in number. I now work closely with the FDLE OIS shoot team and the county medical examiner.

I'm no doctor, but my grandfather practiced ER trauma surgery in New Orleans for 54 years. Not that he's shared anything with me at all.

So what do i know?

Also, your CV doesn't win an argument.

I'm done here. Pry your wares on those more gullible.

[Sensei]

Deleted. Ignore list is your friend.

[BufordTJustice]

Deleted. Ignore list is your friend.

You're on it after this post. Trust me.

And the funny thing is, if you actually had more first hand experience with wounds caused by black tip, you would have said it.

[Sensei]

There's a big difference between an 11.5 556 rifle and an 8.5 300BLK rifle. The weight, handling, OAL, OAL suppressed are drastically different. Shoot, even my 10.5s handle very, very different than my 8.5 300BLK.
I could personally give a crap about cost, availability etc. I would not have made the decision to get into the caliber if I couldn't afford it.
The 300BLK fills an HD role and potential hunting role - neither of which requires me to dump thousands of rounds a year of specialty-class 300BLK down range.
I have no doubt a 10.5/11.5/12.5 556 rifle could probably get the job done - especially with new, niche SBR-specific rounds coming out from Hornady n such, but those rifles will never offer the same small, pointable package my 8.5 does. Especially if you hang a can off the muzzle.

And you touched on the two roles that I think 300blk does better than 5.56 - hunting medium game and PDW +/- a suppressor. I say PDW because the barrier performance with the Tac-Tx through sheet metal and auto glass really is superior to the 5.56 loads out there when it comes to vehicle work. My big gripe with the caliber is that hunting has several acceptable loads, but PDW use has just a couple (maybe only one). If those loads dry up or suffer shortfalls in production, then the 300blk become a lot less attractive for PDW use. We really need manufacturers to design more supersonic loads that do more than yaw once and turn 90 degree out of the gel.

[cwgibson]

I respect Jon. But his data doesn't contradict mine in the slightest. Read closer. Different shots, weights, and distances.

And I've killed a 180lb hog with a 22 WMR to the spinal column. DRT. That doesn't a defensive round make. Most of Jon's shots are spinal column or brain shots. Whereas, I've used the same shot on every hog.

You're obviously not interested in furnishing ANY substantive information on this subject. You're simply regurgitating what other people have anecdotally observed and have made some fairly controversial claims. When you've got some actual first-hand experience, or something else to offer to substantively support your claim, feel free to PM me.

This thread drift is over. You've proven nothing.

Did you document these kills? I would like to see the difference.


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[BufordTJustice]

Did you document these kills? I would like to see the difference.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Not with pictures, unfortunately. Many were made contemporaneously and we had to dress them and haul them across the 990 acre plot so that we could haul them across town to our butcher.

I dressed most of them, helped with the rest, and we examined the wound paths in each. That cartilage plate (exceeding an inch on the heavier hogs) is a tough pre-scapula barrier to get through.

[bzdog]

While I subscribe to the cult of the Barnes Black Tip, note there are some interesting potential rounds in the very light weight offerings from LeHigh and Gorilla around 78gr.

-john