Work In Progress: new F1/F4 guide for 41F submissions

[BigWaylon]

I'm using the F4 that I got from my dealer, with his signature on it. ATF form 4 5320.4 Revised July 2014. I also got a ATF Form 5330.20 Revised April 2006.

That Form 4 is obsolete and won't be accepted. The current forms are linked in the OP.

You don't need a 5330.20, as that info has been added to the current (and previous) forms.

[JG007]

If you draft a trust individually what do you do differently? If you use software what has been updated?

Im asking because it appears as though there are different interpretations and as a result, a lack of consensus on some aspects. See the addition and removal of RP's for example.


Are your trusts unchanged and fingerprints and photographs along with form(s) 5320.23 just included with your application? Is everyone submitting an unofficial certification of CLEO notification?

Have you included statutory language addressing 41F?

Although Gun Trusts seems straightforward, I have noticed a lot of inaccurate information when the topic is discussed generally, and even a number of issues when discussed by attorneys.

[BigWaylon]

Are your trusts unchanged and fingerprints and photographs along with form(s) 5320.23 just included with your application? Is everyone submitting an unofficial certification of CLEO notification?

I'm not a lawyer, and I didn't write my own...so I can't answer the others.

However, I'm not exactly sure what you're asking here.

What kind of unofficial certification are you talking about? There's a proper way to do it, and it's spelled out fairly clearly. The F1/F4/F5 gets sent to CLEO over the address on the form, and a 5320.23 gets sent to a CLEO for each RP (could be the same CLEO, but won't always be)

Prints and photos have to be submitted for all RPs.

I haven't changed my trust and don't plan on doing so. I don't see a reason to add anything specific to 41F to mine. Matter of fact, all the NFA stuff in mine is completely unnecessary. The laws on transfer/travel/etc exist whether they written in my trust or not.

[JG007]

That was a great thread, well done.


I'm mainly interested in what changes to the language and statutory descriptions people are making. The vast majority of gun trust attorneys just buy the software like using turbo tax, I'd expect an update or new program for them.

[SC-Texas]

That was a great thread, well done.


I'm mainly interested in what changes to the language and statutory descriptions people are making. The vast majority of gun trust attorneys just buy the software like using turbo tax, I'd expect an update or new program for them.

I don't just buy the software

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[Jliddle]

A recent form 1 submission has me worried that I may have forgotten to include a copy of my trust.

However if I'm not mistaken I believe one lady on the phone at the office said she didn't necessarily need it. Hopefully it falls into the hands of the right reviewer as they've already cashed my check a month ago.

[BigWaylon]

A recent form 1 submission has me worried that I may have forgotten to include a copy of my trust.

However if I'm not mistaken I believe one lady on the phone at the office said she didn't necessarily need it. Hopefully it falls into the hands of the right reviewer as they've already cashed my check a month ago.

If you didn't submit a copy of the trust, you have a problem. Was it recent enough it was a paper file? Or did you eFile it prior to 7/12?

[Jliddle]

If you didn't submit a copy of the trust, you have a problem. Was it recent enough it was a paper file? Or did you eFile it prior to 7/12?

Paper file. Just after 41f took effect.

[BigWaylon]

Paper file. Just after 41f took effect.

It's possible they send an error letter when they get around to working on it, and the only lost time will be USPS each way.

It's also possible they return it without action, which means you start all over.

You could attempt to call and see if you could email/fax/mail them a copy, but I doubt they could even find that form for months.

[Jliddle]

It's possible they send an error letter when they get around to working on it, and the only lost time will be USPS each way.

It's also possible they return it without action, which means you start all over.

You could attempt to call and see if you could email/fax/mail them a copy, but I doubt they could even find that form for months.

Called them today. Lady on the phone said the examiner will call if she needs anything else than what I provided and give a 30 day grace period. So hopefully that is in fact true and wont be rejected, sending me to the back of the line. IF I did indeed leave the copy of the notarized page out.