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Thread: Preload & bottomed out data needed.

  1. #31
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    Good idea. Thank you. I am going to add something like that atop of original post.

    I believe explaing how to get the data for preload and buffer bottom out to folks would increase likelihood for more and faster data income than it would be without the explanations and skipping folks asking how I did it and me explaining.

  2. #32
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    To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to society. --Theodore Roosevelt--

  3. #33
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    SmugPepe, if people are interested and want to provide you with info, great. If not, just try and obtain that info yourself. I'd recommend contacting companies that sell or manufacturer springs and just ask them for the specs, and make a chart.

    Everyone, quit posting in this thread unless it's on topic; just let it die out if you're not interested. SmugPePe, if people aren't interested, let them be, and don't bump this thread needlessly.

    Edited to add: SmugPePe is young, and English is obviously not his first language. We sometimes mistakenly equate lack of fluency in language to stupidity, which just speaks to our own arrogance. I've been guilty of that.

    As for youth, I'd rather we try to encourage the young folks that show up in our forum with a genuine interest in firearms; they'll grow into older folk who will help us in the fight for our 2A rights. Think 'mentoring'. I feel like I'm fighting a losing battle with the left-leaning millennials I encounter every day, so if we see some that haven't been lost to the dark side yet, let's make sure we don't turn them against us.

    I can take the easy way out as a moderator and lock these threads as soon as I see them spin out of hand. But you know what's stopping me from doing that? The patch below in my sig line. I ask myself: "What would Chuck (Army Chief) do?" He'd mentor, firmly and fairly. And we can all try do that.

  4. #34
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    Hey Smug. I won't knock you for this attempt. The only reason people are mocking is because they think you're low hanging fruit. I don't agree with everything you say, but am in the small camp here that has a relationship with objectivity. I'd surmise that most technical junkies here would be very interested in the spring data you're seeking; many just have an axe to grind with the messenger. I think your method in this "test" could be refined, but you're on the right track. David Tubb put out a video doing almost the same thing; and in a slightly more scientific fashion. It's a great video and definitely worth a watch. He compares his Flatwire spring to a handful of the Sprinco ones. I tried to figure out which exactly; as he doesn't state it in the video. My guess is that he's got a White, Red, and Orange. Honestly, I feel like he may skip the Blue because it likely produces load factors that are very close or identical to his Flatwire spring. But, this could be the starting point you're looking for. Also, if you've got one of those Sprinco springs that he'd used, and can replicate the load factors in your own test, you can add some certainty to the data you find for other springs you plan to test. Good luck!

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8fMVZbrnvu8
    "I actually managed to figure this one out: you've got to find a woman who loves God more than she loves you -- albeit just barely."

    -Army Chief

    I did not know the man quoted above, and joined this Forum after his passing. He seemed to be a leader of men; both spiritually and physically. Someone we'd all be proud to emulate.

  5. #35
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    Honestly? I know Smug has caught a lot of flack, but I went through a similar journey when I had a rash of failures with my rifle. It solved my problems 100%, and now I use the Sprinco Green.


    Making the switch from the Colt/Vltor springs to Sprinco Green has since prevented any malfunctions, and I am glad that I took the time to research it and make the change.


    Here is my data:



    Colt-Vltor spring/A5(Magpul M110) RE
    Pre-load: 6# 13oz
    Buffer bottomed: 11# 6.4oz
    Firearm Function:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rL2aI4Z1wdU
    Firearm Function suppressed:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y41C4yc46Tg

    Sprinco Green/A5(magpul M110) RE
    Pre-load: 8# 3oz
    Buffer bottomed: 13# 12.8oz
    Firearm Function:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dIgpBLcaLg
    Firearm Function suppressed:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uM2pPeLdOo


    *Same A5H2 buffer, BCG, M193 XTAC, etc. used in each slow-motion video
    **Spring pressures obtained with a Magpul M110 RE and A5H1 buffer, and spring, on a food scale, and for bottoming it out, an Expo marker was inserted into the RE after the buffer to depress the buffer to the back of the tube, and since this force exceeded the food-scale, was measured on a digital bathroom scale, and the same reading recorded twice in each case.

    I have done a TON of slow-motion videography on rifle vs. carbine, spring choice, etc. (my YouTube channel has all of this, from JP Tuned in a carbine RE, to TUBB flat in an A5 RE, suppressed, unsuppressed, you name it, I've done that shit and preserved it in slow-motion to evaluate then and later) and arrived at A5/Sprinco Green, with whatever buffer runs your ammo best as my go-to based on both this, and the failures to load that I have had when using mil-spec buffer springs on multiple rifles, once things get dirty. They simply do NOT have the force required to strip ammo from filthy magazines. Period. Follows an example:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyJFcyvXofo

    So yes, I have had REAL WORLD ISSUES with what Pepe is trying to avoid/fix, and yes, I have had these issues muck me up in a training situation multiple times. Sprinco Green. It fixed it all. 100%. The A5 simply runs better than a carbine RE, all the way around, though.
    Last edited by WS6; 11-18-16 at 04:07.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryno12 View Post
    Typically, age isn't always a good metric for knowledge; however, when a person of your age has the grammar skills well below that of a ten year old, coupled with the arrogance of Kanye West, in addition to a locked thread rate of 50%, your credibility has a phenomenal chance to plunge deeper than the Mariana Trench.
    His English is better than my Spanish, I give him that. Let's not equate his mastery (or lack) of a non-native to him language, to his intelligence, or lack. It's rather unfair when I bet most of us only know one language. I also think that his frustration, plus his lack of complete command of the English language has rather made him come off a bit more arrogant than he would prefer.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by AM-15 View Post
    Do you understand the concept of a controlled test ?
    Every one would have to test in the same exact manner using the same equipment or else the results are not controlled.
    Therefor the data cannot be used.
    We could all come close but what is the point.
    If the results are not accurate then there is no purpose.

    JMHO
    I have virtually every spring known to man (Jp polished, Colt, TUBB flatwire 17-7, Sprinco, Magpul mil-spec, you name it, I probably have it, and a video of it) that will fit into a carbine or A5 RE. I compared the ones I cared about, but what worked best for me was actual live-fire and slow-motion videography. My youtube is rife with it. Ultimately? I arrived at the Sprinco Green and A5 buffer tube system as having the best results regarding reliability of performance regardless of variances in ammunition charges and projectile rates used, consistency of cyclic rate from suppressed to unsuppressed, and ability to perform when the weapon system is dirty.

  8. #38
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    WS6, thanks for the useful responses. I think this is an interesting, if not very useful topic. Reading this is reminding me I should probably get some more of the Sprinco green springs (and my pile of standard replacements is looking like a waste of money).

    I don't get the huge need for all the snarky responses, and I also understood what the OP was explaining regarding a method to measure the spring forces.

  9. #39
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    This guy is clearly a 4chan master level troll.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by t15 View Post
    This guy is clearly a 4chan master level troll.
    I'm not his press-guy, nor do I know him in meatspace, but the guy has put forth knowledge---the value of which is being debated---but the point is, he is discovering the world around him by DOING, and he is telling us what he has found, what he thinks, and asking for sensory input from us, as well. Yeah, he isn't going to win any PR awards, yes his English is rather poor, grammatically, and yes, he has rubbed a few people the wrong way, but I personally am able to over-look most of that because he is actually DOING SOMETHING. He isn't taking pot-shots at Vltor with no skin in the game (his money and time and gear), and he isn't making hit-run topics that he doesn't re-visit, and he is contributing his own data and thoughts, as well. I applaud that. Keep in mind that many people who have invented and done and discovered things are not the best people-people, or the best at even presenting their ideas. Also keep in mind and remember that the only time he seems to have lashed out at people with insults is when he is made fun of. He seems sincere, if a bit smug and full of himself. Ya know what though? The world has a way of chopping that sort of attitude down to size. The real tragedy is when it chops down the curiosity and will to experiment and discover, along with it.

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