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Thread: Full Auto M16/m4A1 Resources

  1. #1
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    Full Auto M16/m4A1 Resources

    Ok. So in the midst of Snowpocalypse 2017 here in NC, I built the 1st MG to come out of my shop. Everything seems to be and I'll test it once things thaw out.

    Here's the rub...

    I understand how they work and how to check the timing but I d like to know more of the finer points on adjusting the timing if necessary and other full auto things like how much bite auto sear needs to have on the hammer hook, etc.

    I've been googling for 24h and have only come up with all the Joe Bob's bump fire conversion shit. Are there any books, manuals that are available on how to adjust and tune these things. It's not just voodoo though it seems like it by the results I'm getting.

    As always...thanks so much!

    Sparky
    "An opinion solicited does not equal one freely voiced," Al Swearengen, Deadwood 1877.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparky5019 View Post
    Ok. So in the midst of Snowpocalypse 2017 here in NC, I built the 1st MG to come out of my shop. Everything seems to be and I'll test it once things thaw out.

    Here's the rub...

    I understand how they work and how to check the timing but I d like to know more of the finer points on adjusting the timing if necessary and other full auto things like how much bite auto sear needs to have on the hammer hook, etc.

    I've been googling for 24h and have only come up with all the Joe Bob's bump fire conversion shit. Are there any books, manuals that are available on how to adjust and tune these things. It's not just voodoo though it seems like it by the results I'm getting.

    As always...thanks so much!

    Sparky
    If you are building a MG I am assuming your a Class III dealer with a manufacturing license. So my question is shouldn't you already know how to do all the things your asking about? It sounds kinda fishy to me. I would recommend a good armorers school especially if these MGs your "making" are for our LEO and military service members. Forum answers don't seem to me the right way to learn about MG timing and the nuts and bolts of fine tuning a MG.
    Last edited by st381183; 01-08-17 at 22:35.

  3. #3
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    Wait, the timing of the sear is adjustable? Are you talking DIAS or m16 lower with 3rd pin?

    When the trigger is held back, you want the sear to release the hammer when the bcg goes into battery.

    As long as there is little to no bolt bounce you don't need to time anything as the time for the hammer to drop gives you some room for variation. As long as it drops, you should be g2g.

    Why are you building something you can buy?
    Last edited by MegademiC; 01-08-17 at 22:53.

  4. #4
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    I'm assuming the OP is an 07/02 , FFLsonly.com and Specialized armament being one of the best armorers course that I know of.

  5. #5
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    Yes. I am 07/02 and simply paying a tax doesn't give you the finer points of things.

    Specifically, I'm speaking of a 3rd pin lower. I understand how it works but as I stated the finer points of adjustment and timing are hazy. The lower is built and dry functions properly though I need to make some timing gauges.

    I'm curious if I can find and specs and/or procedures that detail these finer points.

    Thanks!

  6. #6
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    I would think that if your parts are in spec, and your holes are in spec, there isn't any adjustment to be made.
    However, I have a military armorers manual I can look in. But, we just closed down the shop, and I've been packing everything up. If it's where I think it is, I can get my hands on it in a few days. If not, it's going to be awhile.
    I am in VA, so we are in the same boat, weather-wise. I'll be going to the shop again in a few days.
    That's the best I can do, if no one has better.

    Sent from my SGP612 using Tapatalk
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  7. #7
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    +1 for Gunfixr's reply... holes (3rd pin and Hammer pin to a lesser degree) correct and hammer and auto trip parts in spec with in spec bolt carrier, timing is set. In an M16, it is not adjustable (not talking about 22 conversions).

  8. #8
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    I agree. If the sear hole is correctly reamed in the right place, the rest is history. I've heard of sear timing on poorly made RDIAS pieces. But a real auto sear should be fine.
    "You people have too much time on your hands." - scottryan

  9. #9
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    I talked to a Colt armorer yesterday and we came to the same conclusion. My concern was the engagement of the auto sear on the hammer hook; it just seemed too thin compared to std amount of engagememt on the primary SA sear. I figured it would need more than that tiny little bit given the "violent" repetitive movement of the BCG.

    Next thing...

    Yes if holes are in spec timing should be fine but in the interest of precision, troubleshooting and safety...

    Does anyone here think there's a market amount 07/02 for the 3 basic feeler gauges used for timing; 0.100", 0.110", 0.080"?

    Thanks y'all!

  10. #10
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    Personally, just my opinion, but since any fa made by an 07/sot is a post sample, and therefore has a very limited "customer base", it's not likely to be sold. I think most are play toys.
    Le and gov agencies are going to get them from a larger manufacturer, under a contract.
    Yes, we made a fa for a "customer" several yrs ago, but it was still an ffl/sot w/demo letter. The company owns it.

    As for engagement, it's been awhile, but as I recall the hammer "stud" is not that tall, and the sear is a stamped part, meaning not all that thick. I think the stud was just a bit taller than the sear is thick. IIRC, the engagement angle didn't make for a very light disengagement pressure, plus the spring. If it really needed some kind of fine adjustment, I think that would've been added in the design.

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    Last edited by Gunfixr; 01-10-17 at 14:24.
    NRA Life, SASS#40701, Glock Advanced Armorer
    Gunsmith for Unique Armament Creations LLC, 07/SOT

    VIGILIA PRETIUM LIBERTATIS

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