Does the 7N6 round in 5.44x.39 cause more damage than a .308??

[jsbhike]

The ammo used in that video must have been pretty poor.
Army manuals say that 30/06 M2 Ball will penetrate 36" of oak at 200 yards. M80 308 ammo is similar. I've shot through oak similar in diameter to that maple with 7.62x39 Chinese ball.

Arthur Alphin of A Square did a video in the 80's shooting a car motor (pistons removed) with 5.56(no idea what kind, didn't penetrate), 7.62x39 Chinese steel core(left a bulge on the cylinder wall), 7.62x51 lead core ball(entered cylinder wall, but stopped inside) and finally .30 M2 ball that passed completely through.

[HelloLarry]

Art's test is interesting too. But the media being penetrated makes a lot of difference. For instance, which do you think would penetrate cast iron better? Chinese steel core 7.62x39 or LC M193?

Surprisingly enough, the Chicom steel core just dented some cast iron scrap and the M193 penetrated all the way through in my 2 shot experiment.

I haven't shot M193 through wood, but I would be surprised if it kept up with the Chicom x39.

[vicious_cb]

Art's test is interesting too. But the media being penetrated makes a lot of difference. For instance, which do you think would penetrate cast iron better? Chinese steel core 7.62x39 or LC M193?

Surprisingly enough, the Chicom steel core just dented some cast iron scrap and the M193 penetrated all the way through in my 2 shot experiment.

I haven't shot M193 through wood, but I would be surprised if it kept up with the Chicom x39.

When going through steel, velocity and hardness are the name of the game. The goal is to try to get adiabatic shear in the target. For wood and masonry ect the goal is entirely different and mass and high momentum are more important.

[vicious_cb]

5.45(left) next to .224 Valkyrie(right)



Whats old is new...

[HelloLarry]

Except the Valk is about 34.5gr capacity, the 5.45 about 27gr and the .222 Remington lists at 26.9gr.
5.45 is just a Commie .222.

[1168]

5.45(left) next to .224 Valkyrie(right)



Whats old is new...

5.45 is not even quite as potent as .223. Why would you think .224Valk is 5.45 all over again?

[vicious_cb]

Are you guys being dense? The form factor similarity should be obvious but I guess not

[sasquatchoslav]

As to results in the field with hogs I can share my experiences of observing 5.45x39 from a guy that hog hunts with us. First hog always gets it in the head or neck doesn't matter what you use, but on runners lots of them go right on into the woods never recovered with both 5.56 and 5.45. Most all of us hunting thermal have tried it all. 5.56 just not enough damage to slow down the really big hogs with anything less than a head shot. 6.8 awesome light platform, but too $ for me to shot a lot. 7.62x39 light and plenty of punch and cheap kills em dead might prefer this over 308 a bit. 308 is still king in our core group. One guy still uses 5.56. 5.45 one guy used it briefly pretty much same problem as 5.56 on bigger hogs running. My buddy hit what I though was a perfect neck shot on the boar of the year a few weeks ago biggest I've ever laid eyes on a real beast well over 300. Hit him at about 40-50 yards, stumbled and fell on face jumped right back up none of the other shots connected once hog got up to speed. Went under fence no buzzards next day assume he is alive. I'll ask him what load he used I know it's some kind of hunting variant not sure which exactly. all these calibers can kill for sure, but to expect a 5.56 or 5.45x39 to drop them on par with a 308 has not been my observation. I've never seen a hog not dead right there with 308 head neck doesn't matter if it's FMJ, SP it's over like hitting a light switch. Had a few go 20 yards maybe if heart, lung or gut only hogs never recovered with 308 were just whiffs on total runners 20+mph. To that end I've butchered more than a few hogs with multiple 5.56 rounds in it, but it had been killed with my 308. As far as 5.45x39 goes not recovered any projectiles, but I know our one buddy abandoned it quickly over the course of 2016 summer just wasn't able to put the 'runners' down. Goodness sorry for typos not enough coffee on board yet.

[jaholder]

7N6 gets it reputation as being some badassed bullet from the Russians using it in A-stan. Yes, it's a wicked little bullet but no better than any other FMJ that tends to yaw in soft tissue.

The bullet's reputation has less to do with it's effectiveness and more to do with the fact that combat medicine during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan was nonexistent for the Mujaheddin and even Soviet medical treatment at the time was just this side of medieval.

[MountainRaven]

Military Arms Channel did an informal test using steel jacketed lead core bullets shot into a tree; .308, 7.62x39, 5.45x39, and 5.56. Only the 5.45x39 penetrated the larger tree trunk in his first test out of the four calibers. It wasn't even steel core, all the rounds used for the test were Russian steel cased civilian ball ammo. Velocity of 5.45 53gr 7n6 is 2900FPS from a 16" barrel which is close to the 5.56 55gr UMC 2943FPS out of a 16" barrel. Where 5.45 shines though is at distance, since it's designed to tumble no matter the velocity.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=547BKysByqM

A guy at an LGS did an informal test with a variety of defensive loads with propane tanks. Only Liberty Ammunition Civil Defense punched all the way through.

So, naturally, if I'm being attacked by a horde of propane tanks, I'll need Civil Defense ammo. If I'm being attacked by a rabid tree, I'll need 5.45mm.

YMMV.