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Thread: Ive been living under a rock NF ATACR or NXS ??

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slippers View Post
    Just to be clear, the following are my opinions:

    When you talk about 1x performance, it's hard to avoid comparing any low power variable to the Razor 1-6. Razor glass is very good, to my eyes nearly on the level of ATACR glass. The 1x image is excellent, with a wide field of view, low distortion and chromatic aberration, plus great illumination. Sure, it's heavier, and that's the trade-off. The Kahles K16i is of a similar vein, but weighs even less than the razor and has both superior field of view and reticle (in my opinion), with a hair less brightness on the illumination.

    If you place 90% or more of your "value" on 1x performance, then the NX8 and ATACR 1-8 are not necessarily your best choices.
    Great. Thanks. A duel. First, I would agree that the quality of image on the Razoe HD-II and the Kahles is great. I would personally give the Kahles a slight edge, but they are both great. I also have found the Steiner M6Xi 1-6x to be perfect at 1x. This scope, is however, not on the commercial market (yet), so not enough other opinions out there. Also, same is true of the new 1-8x from Schmidt and Bender. All great glass. Probably the Kahles has the best glass.

    In the 1-6x or 1-8x market, I would look at: 1) true 1x performance, 2) point and shoot with two eyes open, 3) clarity of glass, 4) ease of zoom and operation from 1x to 6x, etc., 5) durability of a tactical scope, 6) tracking, 7) ergonomics of turrets and zoom.

    In the glass space, again, I agree with your assessment. In true 1x, that is subjective, but might be a push. In tactical durability, ergonomics, and especially in point and shoot with two eyes open, I believe ATACR excels.

    Where I see the ATACR shining far above any of the current competition is in two eye open true 1x point and shoot. The ATACR has a very large and forgiving eye-box. We have run this with tests with military and LE Swat teams using the best red-dots, like the Aimpoint T-2 and Trijicon MRO, and the ATACR performed pretty close to as well as the red dots. The Steiner and S&B come very close to this performance, and I think the Steiner does best with true 1x performance, but they do not do quite as well -- and I leaves the Kahles far behind, in terms of ability to point and shot, and then magnify. I could see that the Vortex might be a good all around competitor. I don't know that it exceeds the ATACR, but is better in eye box from my eyes than Steiner and Kahles.

    We all have our personal biases, but I put the ATACR one notch ahead of Kahles and Vortex in this market. Steiner and S&B have other benefits, but if I had to pick one overall best, it would be the ATACR.

    The NX8 is not a point and shoot scope. It is a compact scope, light weight and does require a cheek weld to shoot. But in compact performance and ability to zoom out to 8x, it is a great scope and a great value. I have had a number of LE customers choose this over others for sniper teams. The advantage is to be compact and go out to 8x, thus replacing previous scopes that were like the 3-15x or 2.5-10x, etc. It is hard to argue with. Sniper teams are not extreme long distance, and if they are, they are using a bolt gun and 15-25x. For most sniper LE needs, 8x is plenty, and using a gas gun, the NX8 is a great choice. What I find competing with the NX8 is the Trijicon Accupower 1-8x, and the latter wins on price. I can see the Vortex Razor competing in this domain as well, but there are many buyers who see 6x as CQB, and as you get to 8x, you are now potentially replacing another long-range scope, and presenting a case to have only one scope and not two.
    John
    aka LONGSHOT2000


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  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironman8 View Post
    Ive got the NX8 and a K16i (SM1 reticle) to compare it to.

    Glass, FOV, ďflatnessĒ of sight picture, and eyebox are all better on the K16i than the NX8

    That said, Iíll be keeping the NX8 and selling off the K16i. For an AR15 platform, the form factor of the NX8 really canít be beat IMO. Glass is still good, FOV and eyebox are acceptable, and I happen to like the reticle more in the NX8. Both are daylight bright (though NX8 > K16i) but I can pick up the NX8 reticle faster without illumination on, which is one of my primary considerations when picking a LPVO.

    Only question I have for those who have the NX8 is have you tried eliminating the slight fisheye effect by adjusting the diopter? Iíve played with it a little, and I still have a slight fisheye, but after a few seconds looking through it and mounting the gun, I donít notice it...which is why I havenít played with the diopter further.
    How does the glass compare to the Trijicon 1-8? That is absolutely "the floor", and the shittiest glass I can tolerate.

    *YMMV

  3. #23
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    It may seem strange, but I like posts like this. They get some life to them, and we get intelligent, well spoken opinions on products. Many of you communicate very well your likes and dislikes and your opinions. I agree with most of what has been posted, so I won’t rehash it out again.

    My opinion, the NX8 is an awesome optical feat right now. To get everything NF has done in a compact package and overall footprint, they nailed it. Is the glass perfect? No. Is it 100%, COMPLETELY flat? No. What it is is an amazing 1-8 FFP, great glass, insanely daylight bright scope in a 1-4 sized, 17oz package. To hit the market with all that at the NX8 price point, some compromise had to be made.

    Want perfection? The ATACR 1-8 is about perfect. Sure there are PERSONAL things folks might change, like the speed of diopter adjustment, and whether the eyepiece moves when you adjust power, but those are personal likes and dislikes. The glass is insanely good. It’s clear, flat, handles color well, and the reticle is fantastic. It’s literally a 4-16 ATACR shrunk down. Downside is... bigger, and it’s $2500. For WHAT it does and who it is, it’s amazing. I feel like it has no equal. Believe me, I didn’t WANT to like it. I didn’t WANT it to be so good. I didn’t WANT to spend 4K in scopes in a couple months. When Sonny, the LE rep for NF sent it to me, I could hear him chuckling. He knew it was a game changer. He was right. It’s amazing. Alas..... nothing that good is cheap.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by longshot2000 View Post
    Great. Thanks. A duel.
    Looks like we actually agree on almost everything.

    Quote Originally Posted by WS6 View Post
    How does the glass compare to the Trijicon 1-8? That is absolutely "the floor", and the shittiest glass I can tolerate.

    *YMMV
    The NX8 is better than the Trijicon in multiple ways, including the glass.
    Will - Owner of Arisaka LLC - http://www.arisakadefense.com

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by WS6 View Post
    How does the glass compare to the Trijicon 1-8? That is absolutely "the floor", and the shittiest glass I can tolerate.

    *YMMV
    I havenít looked through the Trij yet so canít comment. I will say that Iím no glass snob either (not saying you are...unless you are lol)

    Before picking up the NX8 and K16i, the optic I had on my rig was the SWFA 1-6x. I still probably like that reticle the best (very bold and can be used w/o illumination in just about every lighting condition). But I took all three out behind my house at dusk to see how the glass compares. IMO, those 30 mins on either end of the day is where good glass really shows.

    There was no question the SWFA was below the other two. I could pick out more detail with the K16i than the NX8, but the difference wasnít that much to my eyes. Also just a note, I compared the NX8 on 6x instead of 8x to keep things apples to apples. What I like about the NX8 in those lighting conditions is that you can power down a bit for the better exit pupil and still have your holds true with the FFP reticle.

    Like I mentioned above, the biggest difference between the K16i and NX8 is the 1x FOV and eyebox. The difference in glass quality isnít even a concern to me.
    Last edited by Ironman8; 06-27-18 at 13:43.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slippers View Post
    Just to be clear, the following are my opinions:

    When you talk about 1x performance, it's hard to avoid comparing any low power variable to the Razor 1-6. Razor glass is very good, to my eyes nearly on the level of ATACR glass. The 1x image is excellent, with a wide field of view, low distortion and chromatic aberration, plus great illumination. Sure, it's heavier, and that's the trade-off. The Kahles K16i is of a similar vein, but weighs even less than the razor and has both superior field of view and reticle (in my opinion), with a hair less brightness on the illumination.

    If you place 90% or more of your "value" on 1x performance, then the NX8 and ATACR 1-8 are not necessarily your best choices. There's no reason to pay the price for the ATACR or compromise on the NX8 if you rarely make use of 6-8x magnification. The K16i weighs the same as the NX8 and to me is optically superior across the entire magnification range where they overlap. The only downside is the longer scope length, yet I still don't feel like my K16i gets in the way because it's a couple inches longer than an NX8. And frankly, despite my NF love, I hate their diopter adjustment. Quick adjust diopters like the K16i and Razor have are my preference.

    Every scope has a compromise of some sort. Some less than others. The ATACR is an awesome all-around performer and you can't go wrong with it.
    Dude. Quoted for truth on the diopter. I feel that the human eye changes more day to day than it aloows you to dial into account. It drives me crazy. It's too precise, lol

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironman8 View Post
    I haven’t looked through the Trij yet so can’t comment. I will say that I’m no glass snob either (not saying you are...unless you are lol)

    Before picking up the NX8 and K16i, the optic I had on my rig was the SWFA 1-6x. I still probably like that reticle the best (very bold and can be used w/o illumination in just about every lighting condition). But I took all three out behind my house at dusk to see how the glass compares. IMO, those 30 mins on either end of the day is where good glass really shows.

    There was no question the SWFA was below the other two. I could pick out more detail with the K16i than the NX8, but the difference wasn’t that much to my eyes. Also just a note, I compared the NX8 on 6x instead of 8x to keep things apples to apples. What I like about the NX8 in those lighting conditions is that you can power down a bit for the better exit pupil and still have your holds true with the FFP reticle.

    Like I mentioned above, the biggest difference between the K16i and NX8 is the 1x FOV and eyebox. The difference in glass quality isn’t even a concern to me.
    The swfa to my eyes is better than trijicon. Ymmv.
    If the k16i is even similar to the nx8, it's good enough for me.

    I am a glass snob, but I temper that mental masturbation with common sense. The trijicon 1 to 8 in cloudy weather was just dim and grainy to my eyes.

    True unity is tops to me. If I can use the nx8 on 1x without ANY double vision, I'll tolerate fisheye, tunneling, pincushion, pretty much anything else. I just need that glowing dot to be on exactly the same plane as my unaided eye.
    Last edited by WS6; 06-28-18 at 03:08.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegasshooter View Post
    It may seem strange, but I like posts like this. They get some life to them, and we get intelligent, well spoken opinions on products. Many of you communicate very well your likes and dislikes and your opinions. I agree with most of what has been posted, so I won’t rehash it out again.

    My opinion, the NX8 is an awesome optical feat right now. To get everything NF has done in a compact package and overall footprint, they nailed it. Is the glass perfect? No. Is it 100%, COMPLETELY flat? No. What it is is an amazing 1-8 FFP, great glass, insanely daylight bright scope in a 1-4 sized, 17oz package. To hit the market with all that at the NX8 price point, some compromise had to be made.

    Want perfection? The ATACR 1-8 is about perfect. Sure there are PERSONAL things folks might change, like the speed of diopter adjustment, and whether the eyepiece moves when you adjust power, but those are personal likes and dislikes. The glass is insanely good. It’s clear, flat, handles color well, and the reticle is fantastic. It’s literally a 4-16 ATACR shrunk down. Downside is... bigger, and it’s $2500. For WHAT it does and who it is, it’s amazing. I feel like it has no equal. Believe me, I didn’t WANT to like it. I didn’t WANT it to be so good. I didn’t WANT to spend 4K in scopes in a couple months. When Sonny, the LE rep for NF sent it to me, I could hear him chuckling. He knew it was a game changer. He was right. It’s amazing. Alas..... nothing that good is cheap.
    The ocular is huge to me. If you've never shot in <20*f weather, this may not make sense. However, if you have, these complaints of stiff adjustment in the Vegas desert during June should be alarming. Even the regular mag ring only adjustment gets stiff as hell on the nxs 1 to 4 in my experience. I dont want to arm wrestle may changes in the cold.

    I need to call Sonny, but I want an NX8, so I also dont want to speak with him, rofl
    Last edited by WS6; 06-28-18 at 03:13.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by WS6 View Post
    The ocular is huge to me. If you've never shot in <20*f weather, this may not make sense. However, if you have, these complaints of stiff adjustment in the Vegas desert during June should be alarming. Even the regular mag ring only adjustment gets stiff as hell on the nxs 1 to 4 in my experience. I dont want to arm wrestle may changes in the cold.

    I need to call Sonny, but I want an NX8, so I also dont want to speak with him, rofl
    Hahahahaha, I understand that about not wanting to call him then.
    He LITERALLY told me to “Rest up”, because I was going to spend a lot of time on glass when my ATACR 1-8 arrived. He was more right then not.

    No, in Vegas we don’t have issues with the diopter being too stiff. It gets cold to us... like 20*, but not COLD per se. now.... when I’m on the line teaching and it’s 116*, I would gladly trade.

    Call him up..... at your own risk. Lol.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by 100 View Post
    ATACR glass is better than NXS glass.
    SFP will suit your needs for hunting and fun on steel.
    Something to keep in mind if wanting to take shots at a mile, the ATACR 5~25x56 has 120MOA of elevation compared to the 5.5~22x50 which is limited to 100MOA.
    With that said, the 5.5~22x50 is a great long hunting scope.
    Not to be a #$%^, but that has zero to do with the conversation (NX-8 vs ATACR 1-8x).
    - Rhino

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