Voter Fraud

[Campbell]

I think the people caught above prove the opposite of what you claim it does. Not ONE illegal voted in the whole State? Or our ability to identify anyone as illegal on voting rolls is close to ZERO?

Now I'm sceptical of the wild "millions" claims too, but no more than those who claim zero. I suspect the number is somewhere between, and large enough to swing the results in some places.

BINGO.

[ABNAK]

While I certainly believe the Founding Fathers has great wisdom in creating the Electoral College, it does make voter fraud "easier" if you will. No need for millions voting illegally across the country; that might be too "above the radar" for it to be poo-pooed and ignored. No, the Electoral College allows for the zeroing in on critical districts within a close state that can tip that state's electoral votes one way or another. Since the majority of states have "winner take all" electoral policies it can be a ripe opportunity for tomfoolery.

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

While I certainly believe the Founding Fathers has great wisdom in creating the Electoral College, it does make voter fraud "easier" if you will. No need for millions voting illegally across the country; that might be too "above the radar" for it to be poo-pooed and ignored. No, the Electoral College allows for the zeroing in on critical districts within a close state that can tip that state's electoral votes one way or another. Since the majority of states have "winner take all" electoral policies it can be a ripe opportunity for tomfoolery.

Actually the opposite. It creates choke-points where you can carefully watch the process. Think of it this way. You either have to watch 10 districts closely, or every single ballot voted everywhere? One is controlling the Straights of Gibraltar and the other is trying to control the whole Med. The EC wasn't meant to prevent fraud in voting, but it is an outcome of the process.

[RetroRevolver77]

They are already rigging small elections, just that one here in Ohio had a bunch of people voting that were over the age of 115 still on the registry. Then they found a bunch of ballots that were of course 3 to 1 for the Democrat. Point being, they are going to pull out all the stops now.

[26 Inf]

I think the people caught above prove the opposite of what you claim it does. Not ONE illegal voted in the whole State? Or our ability to identify anyone as illegal on voting rolls is close to ZERO?

Now I'm sceptical of the wild "millions" claims too, but no more than those who claim zero. I suspect the number is somewhere between, and large enough to swing the results in some places.

I agree with all you posted except:and large enough to swing the results in some places.

Let's think critically for a moment. If the numbers were true, and the belief was that most of those illegal voters were casting Republican votes, how many of you would be calling for action? I'd be willing to bet that Ol' Omar, the DA of Starr County, Texas, for one, would be keeping his fvcking yap shut.

That is what is bullshit about this whole deal, at it's heart it isn't really about the rule of law, it is about gaining political advantage.

Onerous voter registration laws, such as Kobach pushes, are designed to make it more troublesome and difficult for lower income and minority folks to vote. In many places these are the folks who are likely to vote Democrat.

Ol' Fatboy Republicans such as myself, are likely to have registered 20 or 30 years ago, and kept up with address changes as we bought new houses. I just show up, show them my DL (which pisses me off - they wont take my retired ID because it doesn't have an address) and vote.

Now, my neighbor down the street who just moved into a nice rental, has to have her driver's license (or state ID card), and birth certificate to register to vote. As noted if she doesn't have a DL she has to get a state id card.

Personally, I don't find that hard to do, largely because my wife is uber-organized and has packets for each of us containing birth certificates, social security cards, adoption papers, divorce decrees, marriage certificates, DD214's, retirement papers, etc.

If I was on my own I'd be hosed, I'd have to plan enough ahead of time to get a copy of my birth certificate, because I had one once, but I lost it, then stand in line waiting to register. I'd be a lot less likely to register to vote.

The redundancy here is that to get the original DL or State ID you have to show the birth certificate and proof of your address - a utility bill or some other proof. Don't make much sense to me.

[ABNAK]

I agree with all you posted except:and large enough to swing the results in some places.

Let's think critically for a moment. If the numbers were true, and the belief was that most of those illegal voters were casting Republican votes, how many of you would be calling for action? I'd be willing to bet that Ol' Omar, the DA of Starr County, Texas, for one, would be keeping his fvcking yap shut.

That is what is bullshit about this whole deal, at it's heart it isn't really about the rule of law, it is about gaining political advantage.

Onerous voter registration laws, such as Kobach pushes, are designed to make it more troublesome and difficult for lower income and minority folks to vote. In many places these are the folks who are likely to vote Democrat.

Ol' Fatboy Republicans such as myself, are likely to have registered 20 or 30 years ago, and kept up with address changes as we bought new houses. I just show up, show them my DL (which pisses me off - they wont take my retired ID because it doesn't have an address) and vote.

Now, my neighbor down the street who just moved into a nice rental, has to have her driver's license (or state ID card), and birth certificate to register to vote. As noted if she doesn't have a DL she has to get a state id card.

Personally, I don't find that hard to do, largely because my wife is uber-organized and has packets for each of us containing birth certificates, social security cards, adoption papers, divorce decrees, marriage certificates, DD214's, retirement papers, etc.

If I was on my own I'd be hosed, I'd have to plan enough ahead of time to get a copy of my birth certificate, because I had one once, but I lost it, then stand in line waiting to register. I'd be a lot less likely to register to vote.

The redundancy here is that to get the original DL or State ID you have to show the birth certificate and proof of your address - a utility bill or some other proof. Don't make much sense to me.

Can you walk into a gun shop and buy a weapon with a non-official ID? How about buying beer? (in TN you have to show ID no matter how old you look, state law)

Would seem to me that if you wanted to vote bad enough you'd get an official ID, especially since IIRC most states issue them for free (not the driver's licenses, they ding you for that, but just a state ID). Not to mention a good portion of these "downtrodden" and [I just LOVE this term] "disenfranchised" folks get bussed in on election day, but can't seem to get a ride to obtain their free state-issued ID? Nah, ain't buying it.

Sorry, you cannot have unfettered access to voting. It cannot be a circus. There has to be order in it. If you have to prove who you are officially to buy a gun (another Constitutional right I might add), or even buy a six-pack, then you sure as hell should have to show official ID to vote.

[ABNAK]

Actually the opposite. It creates choke-points where you can carefully watch the process. Think of it this way. You either have to watch 10 districts closely, or every single ballot voted everywhere? One is controlling the Straights of Gibraltar and the other is trying to control the whole Med. The EC wasn't meant to prevent fraud in voting, but it is an outcome of the process.

Let's agree that it is a double-edged sword then. I see your point, but surely you see the other side of the blade in my post above yours.

[Business_Casual]

How many of us are signed up to be poll watchers?

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

Let's agree that it is a double-edged sword then. I see your point, but surely you see the other side of the blade in my post above yours.

The Dems want to get rid of the EC and go to popular vote, that seems like the more dangerous 'side'. I know what you mean. Something like a couple of hundred thousand votes (tenths of a percent of the popular vote) is what carried Trump in those swing states. So that would be a model for hundreds of votes per county would be enough to move enough states to shift elections.

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

How many of us are signed up to be poll watchers?

I can only watch after my Mom's shift is over...