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Thread: Would you feel under-gunned using Federal 9BPLE?

  1. #11
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    I'm not sold on any wonder bullet. I think ammo choices have improved over the ears but it still comes down to placement. To answer your question, no I wouldn't but it wouldn't be my first choice. I have a pretty good stash of the old +P+ 115 load that Remington used to market for the subguns. We used itin our MP-5's back in the day. From a Glock 19 it hit's 1250-1300. It may be warm but I've never wore out my Glocks, even use it in the 43. In a 1911 it's almost gentle.
    For you have armed me with strength for the
    battle, you have subdued under me those who rose up against me. I have pursued
    my enemies and overtaken them. Neither did I turn back again till they were
    destroyed.

  2. #12
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    Nope, don't feel underpinned at all. If we are going to believe that the 9mm is no worse than a .45 and that shot placement is king, then we have to accept that even older designs will get the work done if placed properly. Expansion is a plus, and the soft lead of the Federal round help that out.

    Would I choose this to arm a PD with? No, as noted the penetration is more erratic than newer designs. But, for personal defense where full frontal shots are a lot more common than cross-torso shots, car doors, auto glass, barriers, etc... it will work fine.

    Plus, it's cheap enough to 1) practice with, 2) feeds in damn near everything so that you can trust it across a myriad of guns if you aren' the hard core, "One Glock 19 only" kind of guy, and 3) is just about a target round it's so accurate.

    I use 9BPLE in a variety of weapons as needs dictate and while not as "good" as something like HST or Gold Dot, humans haven't changed in the last 20 years, and it used to be considered the proverbial death ray that brought 9mm up to the standard of a .45.

    I know we can't quantify the effects of velocity of handgun bullets on the human body and so tend to ignore it, can't rely on it, but street reports, hunting anecdotes, and people as esteemed as Mas Ayoob and his shooting of pigs in an abattoir show it is doing something. Maybe it's enough to change the day, maybe not, but if you don't have it, it can't work.

    Before the torches and pitch forks come out, I agree - permanent crush cavity is the only thing which can be relied upon, and this load expands readily. Still, for centuries faster = better. What is the cutoff/threshold? 110lb woman crazy on meth or a 350lb biker drunk and pissed off - they are going to react differently. Just like .270 vs .30-06, depends on the target and shot placement. If velocity didn't matter, we wouldn't have .357 or .44 magnums, which arguably perform better than their parent cartridges. +P+ in a 9mm isn't a gold mine/winning lottery ticket, but it does give an edge that I'll take any day.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by seb5 View Post
    I'm not sold on any wonder bullet.
    Neither am I. But I don't use the fact there are no "wonder bullets" to discount the advances in consistent expansion and performance through barriers modern testing has given us.

    There is no good reason to keep a stockpile of old HP ammo. As a sunk cost it doesn't matter how much you paid for it then, it's really just good for practice ammo now.

    Getting enough of something from the list to fill your go mags doesn't cost that much.

  4. #14
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    My experience with GSW's is that placement trumps penetration, expansion, or any other matrices of performance, within reason.

  5. #15
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    I wouldn't feel under gunned with it. I wouldn't feel under gunned loaded with ball ammo either. I would just understand the limitations of the round and proceed on.

    Would i personally seek it out and buy it for carry? No. There are better performing bullets out there.
    C co 1/30th Infantry Regiment
    3rd Brigade 3rd Infantry Division
    2002-2006
    OIF 1 and 3

    IraqGunz:
    No dude is going to get shot in the chest at 300 yards and look down and say "What is that, a 3 MOA group?"

  6. #16
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    I started a similar thread months ago, and I got great info. I’ll see if I can find it. I ended up with Federal ammo that wasn’t a buck a round and it was considered good enough.

    PB
    "Air Force / Policeman / Fireman / Man of God / Friend of mine / R.I.P. Steve Lamy"

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pappabear View Post
    I started a similar thread months ago, and I got great info. I’ll see if I can find it. I ended up with Federal ammo that wasn’t a buck a round and it was considered good enough.

    PB
    Hst, golddot, and winchester bonded (all147gr) can all be had for less than 50 cents a round.
    There are a lot of options on The List for ~ 50 cents a shot.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by C-grunt View Post
    I wouldn't feel under gunned with it. I wouldn't feel under gunned loaded with ball ammo either. I would just understand the limitations of the round and proceed on.

    Would i personally seek it out and buy it for carry? No. There are better performing bullets out there.
    This ^ exactly!

    Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

  9. #19
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    It wouldnt be my first choice or even 2nd or 3rd but I wouldnt feel under armed. At worst it will perform like an FMJ, its not like 9mm ball is less than lethal or anything.

  10. #20
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    Is this the ammunition to which you are referring? https://www.streichers.com/federal-c...uty-ammunition

    My agency carried a Winchester 115g +P+ cartridge for years, because the people in our firearm section were varmint hunters and related it to the .22-250. It chronographed at 1340 fps out of a 4" S&W barrel.

    None of the people I spoke with in our firearm section had ever seen it used in the field. Those of us who had seen it used in the field had a different opinion and were happy when the agency stopped issuing the cartridge.

    I still have access to a substantial quantity of 115g +P+ ammunition, but prefer to carry Speer Gold Dot ammunition in my 9mm concealed carry pistols.
    Train 2 Win

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