Geissele Maritime Bolt Catch

[26 Inf]

Thank you guys 26 Inf, what are your thoughts on the ABC/R v2?

I like the ABC/R v2. I'm a lefty so I use my trigger finger to let the bolt go home. I have fairly large hands. I can easily reach either the Mari-Time (which broke) or the ABC/R without shifting anything. The stock bolt catch is also reachable, but I have to shift my grip a little. Amazing what a little extra pad does to ease the process.

My recollection of the Mari-Time catch on this rifle is that it felt harder to press to let the bolt go forward than with the ABC/R v2 on the same rifle. I still have Mari-Time catches on all my rifles with KAC ambi mag releases (more on this later) and testing those rifles I noticed the same thing IF my finger was on the extended rearward portion of the Mari-Time. With fingers on the center of the pad, release pressure was essentially the same. I think it is a leverage thing.

In comparing the Mari-Time catch to the ABC/R v2 mounted onto rifles, the ABC/R v2 pad appearer to be 'taller' than the Mari-Time pad, and by my measurements it was, .72 from the bolt catch pin to the top, compared to .64 for the Mari-Time.

The ABC/R v2 pad extends .2 rearward from the catch shaft, while the Mari-Time extends .664. This is obviously a substantial difference. As I noted above, the additional length of the Mari-Time catch, plus the fact that the end portion of the Mari-Time's extended pad is approximately .21 lower than the highest portion of the pad, makes the Mari-Time harder to depress and release the bolt with less than optimal finger placement.

About the KAC ambi mag release: I like them. One of the reasons I went with the Mari-Time's over the ABC/R's was that the KAC doesn't work with the ABC/R. Another reason, quite frankly was the cost, $29.00 versus $42.00. At the time I wasn't concerned about the reliability of the Mari-Time, now, however, I see the utility in billet machined versus cast.

As for the KAC ambi mag release, I'm going to stay with the ones I have and probably use the Seekins enhanced bolt catches and see if 'manufactured using metal injected molding (MIM) process allowing the selection of a proprietary material that is considerably stronger than our original billet model or a factory Mil-Spec Bolt catch' is actually true. Any new builds for me will have the ABC/R v2.

[Duffy]

Thank you for your thoughts on the ABC/R!

I was surprised to hear ABC/R didn't work with your KAC's ambi mag catch, I was sure it was tested back in 2015 or 2014 (the old version of it while I was still at BAD), but I just installed it again to be sure, and it is compatible.



It works well with KAC's, the angled lower paddle that protrudes further out from the receiver works well with all known ambi mag catches, including the very tall High Velocity Arms AMR. ABC/R as designed in 2014, and finalized in 2015 under FCD, was meant to be an ambi mag catch friendly bolt catch. Most of the effort went into the lower paddle at first, its angled and serrated paddle provided a unique surface that stands out from the vertical receiver and ambi mag catch lever, its protrusion from the receiver is measured, just enough to make it easy to differentiate from the receiver and ambi mag catch lever, but no more than that.

Military Morons did a review on it in 2015 http://www.militarymorons.com/weapon...cess5.html#fcd MM went into greater details with illustrations.

[26 Inf]

Thank you for your thoughts on the ABC/R!

I was surprised to hear ABC/R didn't work with your KAC's ambi mag catch, I was sure it was tested back in 2015 or 2014 (the old version of it while I was still at BAD), but I just installed it again to be sure, and it is compatible.

Duh, Two years ago I made this thread: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread...azine-Releases From that thread:

I received the two EMR-A's I ordered a couple days ago.....I like them, a lot. I installed one on my SBR replacing the Norgon clone that I had installed on the rifle. At first I was not going to use the extra spring rate mag spring. I compared the springs by compressing them in my hand, the enhanced spring felt a lot stiffer, about 60% stiffer I'd guess. I figured the mag release would be too stiff for my liking with the enhanced spring installed. Then I figured WTF, I can take it out if it don't like it.

Surprisingly, when installed there wasn't appreciably more effort required than with the normal spring.

At this point I have had the Troy, Norgon (clone), and KAC ambi releases installed on rifles with the KAC being my favorite. The KAC lever is longer than the FCD EMR-A lever. However, for me this is not an issue, I easily and naturally reach both of them. The EMR-A is far less likely to be rendered inoperable by something snagging on it than the KAC.

This moves it up on chart for me in terms of like. Subjectively, to me both the KAC and EMR-A require about the same amount of effort.

The only downside: I have also experimented with a couple different style bolt catch/releases. I was looking for one that moved the release pad further to the rear of the rifle for lefty use. At this point the ones I have used are the Seekins Enhanced Bolt Catch and the Geissele Maritime Bolt Catch. I far prefer the Maritime Catch. On my rifles, the EMR-A will not work with the Geissele Maritime Bolt Catch without modification to the catch.

I don't know how I twisted that into KAC won't work with ABC/R, but I did, and I'ver been following that mantra all the while. Wow! I can do some switching around.

[Duffy]

Haha I remember it, I wrote in that thread too

EMR-A isn’t compatible with MBC, we won’t be making one to be compatible either, it’s the same sentiment as I had in 2017. MBC has a lot of over correction in its design.

[titsonritz]

Haha I remember it, I wrote in that thread too

EMR-A isn’t compatible with MBC, we won’t be making one to be compatible either, it’s the same sentiment as I had in 2017. MBC has a lot of over correction in its design.

Your's is superior.

[Duffy]

Thank you

ABC/R v3 incorporates what some users have asked for in the lower paddle in that it's slightly extended, while maintaining a healthy standoff distance from ambi mag catch levers, but the most important part is the upper paddle options. V3's upper paddle isn't modular, but there will be 3 options for it to better suit the user's loading/reloading method.

[ssc]

Roger, may I respectfully suggest a new thread where we can provide feedback on the ABC/R v2? I am not a fan of the G MBC and would rather see a dedicated thread for your product. Frankly, I find the ABC/R v2 to be outstanding for more than one reason. I also appreciate your CS.

Cheers, Steve

[26 Inf]

Haha I remember it, I wrote in that thread too

EMR-A isn’t compatible with MBC, we won’t be making one to be compatible either, it’s the same sentiment as I had in 2017. MBC has a lot of over correction in its design.

I'm going to replace the MBC's on my rifles with ABC/R v2's over the next couple months. At some point I must have seen a deal on MBC's because I have several hanging on my pegboard and I wouldn't have stockpiled them at list price.

I trust that when you make the extended pads with a rearward bias you will ensure it doesn't take excess pressure to manipulate with less than optimal finger position. I think the issue I experienced was a result of the tail of the MBC pad being lower that the main body and therefore decreasing leverage.

[titsonritz]

Roger, may I respectfully suggest a new thread where we can provide feedback on the ABC/R v2? I am not a fan of the G MBC and would rather see a dedicated thread for your product. Frankly, I find the ABC/R v2 to be outstanding for more than one reason. I also appreciate your CS.

Cheers, Steve

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread...=ABC%2FR+catch

[Duffy]

ABC/R v3 FB and RB as designed are in line with our measured and practical design theme. We're very careful about over correction, and we've never done it on any FCD products. The amount of bias was going to be as little as 10%, but 10% wasn't enough to make a meaningful difference, so we went a bit further.

For every 0.1" of bias, forward or rearward, there is a corresponding 0.05" decrease in the other direction, it is not our intention to make the upper paddle bigger, but bigger it has to be, we can't do a 1:1 shift, because we don't want to remove the usability of the upper paddle if you finger happens to land on the side that's not extended.

I wrote about and posted my thoughts on over correction on our site: http://www.forwardcontrolsdesign.com...n_ep_69-1.html Though not specifically related to bolt catches, as a rule, when we increase the surface area, or decrease it, for that matter, it's done with caution and consideration, thus it's always calculated. Bigger isn't better, it's just a lazy designer's way to "improve" something that often just brings about unintended consequences.