The "Best" All-Around Optic for your AR?

[pointblank4445]

I actually don't like the H27D either. I just think they took an interesting approach in making the "circle" ring become the "dot" on 1x.

And I 100% agree that it's one thing to work the balance in having the right balance between bold visibility and fine aiming in a reticle...much less at both ends of magnification...now consider it WITHOUT flash dot tech and it's impossible.
Again, without the Dual FP concept, the best I can figure would be a sort of Tri-plex design (similar to the TMR works in the CQBSS) in conjunction with a circle (like the S&B A9) that doesn't get in the way of finer shooting on top magnification, but still uses the eye's ability to use concentricity (think AUG "doughnut of death") on 1x. This should leave the user with bold stadia a 3/6/9 up to the circle inside of which the user would have the middle stadia at 3/6/9 forming a sort of TMR open center surrounded by a doughnut of death circle...that could work decently in a pinch. Example: https://i.imgur.com/OrBNytF.jpg

I mean, for all intents and purposes the CQBSS TMR would fit the bill IF Leupold had LED/Flash Dot/Aimpoint Tech rather than what could be considered "super illumination" and illuminating the secondary stadia of the "triplex". I would've rather they give me a tiny dot in the center of the TMR (like what Kahles does with the MSR for the MSR-K reticle) and I could live with a FFP dot on the low end. Only problem there is your screwed for any sort of illumination on the top end...better have your clip-on NVG.

Re: the "CC" mode on the S&B's...I suspect it's going to be the achilles heel of that design. As I noted, mine had to go back for repair because of it. From what I see of the Dual FP, it's s#it hot. But it ought to be at $4250-4500 (RAL and Pantone cost extra). Their "MDR" reticles are a step in the right direction, but dang if they aren't still hung up on this super fine, skeletonized reticle lines.

[jmnielsen]

For me it is the Razor E. I can run it every bit as fast as a red dot, but have 6x magnification. I use it on my 11.5 SBR for everything from multigun matches, to coyote hunting, so drills at 5-10 yards. I really like the PST gen 2 1-6 as well, but if I didn't have a razor I would have a Steiner Px4i. I had one before the razor and wish I would have kept the steiner to put on a different rifle. It really is a great optic at a great price that I feel a lot of people don't even know about.

[MA2_Navy_Veteran]

Like many of the posts above, the answer really depends on your definition of "best" & the particulars of the intended "use" or "need".

When I was younger, I would have recommended a number of different Aimpoint (or other red-dot) optics regardless of their energy requirements, simply because of their ease of use under most circumstances.
Unfortunately, the older I get, the more difficult it is to actually use red-dot-type optics as the "dots" become more "splintered" due to natural astigmatism issues.
Nowadays, I am a firm believer in the use of slightly-magnified, ACOG-type optics, as these do not seem to suffer the reticule splintering issue associated with red-dots & astigmatism, and the slight magnification of the ACOGs does help to extend the range of my accuracy a bit, and yet in a pinch, can still be used like a red-dot (with both eyes open) for targets that are closer in, though I should add that even when using ACOGs - regular practice is still essential.

Also - I do not believe in having only one weapon for everything, but rather, in using the right tool for the right job. A pistol with either IR &/or visible laser for use in CQ or indoors, alongside a carbine (or rifle) with ACOG, & IR/Visible laser for mid-to-long range encounters is pretty much my go-to choice for doing things.

No matter what you use - the most important thing is regular practice/training with your chosen optic, because "when the proverbial crap hits the fan" is not the time to start becoming familiar with your optics & firearms.

[prepare]

For civilian self defense the mission criteria should be pretty easy to figure out. Its 99% likely that any type of situation where a civilian will be using a rifle for defensive purposes will be within your house or within a very near perimeter of it.

[pointblank4445]

For civilian self defense the mission criteria should be pretty easy to figure out. Its 99% likely that any type of situation where a civilian will be using a rifle for defensive purposes will be within your house or within a very near perimeter of it.

....yeah....kinda. By and large, statistically speaking, the most likely of legally justified scenarios is of the home and the immediate surrounding property. But remember that most live in urban and suburban areas that would support that idea.

I can tell you from personal experience that having a magnified optic can also be an incredibly useful tool in a close-quarter urban setting. Being able to see fine details and potentially engage partially exposed targets is critical. I recall one such scenario where I was posted on a door that was open about 1/2" and I was 30 yards away. With a mere 4x magnification, I could tell there was somebody behind that door when my Eotech-clad partner had no idea we were about to make contact.

I don't know what the future holds. Bad people change up tactics, and times may get harder. People travel, people own and maintain large tracts of open land.

Case in point, I'd call myself a good guy and I'm a precision rifleman by trade. Were I to not be a good guy...do you think I would be playing to my strengths and training were we to go toe to toe?

[Dr. Bullseye]

....yeah....kinda. By and large, statistically speaking, the most likely of legally justified scenarios is of the home and the immediate surrounding property. But remember that most live in urban and suburban areas that would support that idea.

I can tell you from personal experience that having a magnified optic can also be an incredibly useful tool in a close-quarter urban setting. Being able to see fine details and potentially engage partially exposed targets is critical. I recall one such scenario where I was posted on a door that was open about 1/2" and I was 30 yards away. With a mere 4x magnification, I could tell there was somebody behind that door when my Eotech-clad partner had no idea we were about to make contact.

I don't know what the future holds. Bad people change up tactics, and times may get harder. People travel, people own and maintain large tracts of open land.

Case in point, I'd call myself a good guy and I'm a precision rifleman by trade. Were I to not be a good guy...do you think I would be playing to my strengths and training were we to go toe to toe?

Which is why I have a 2.5x prism. But as I bounce outta bed in the dark and confront theoretical opponents at 5-50 feet, inside and in the yard, a red dot may be better or irons. But, as you say, if they are out there and hiding behind trees etc., and only expose parts of themselves, a magnified optic lets you make those smaller shots even though they are close.

[n4aof]

I am at a crossroads.
...in your opinion is there one military or SHTF grade optic suitable in all situations and that has limitations you can easily live with?

Think the best answer can be found in the post that said:

Every optic I try has advantages and disadvantages as one would expect

Bottom line: There is not, never has been, and never will be, any one best anything.

Even when you limit application to one specific purpose, personal preferences will still tip the balance among some group of top contenders.

But when you try for "in all situations" you end up asking for something like a 1-50 power scope with the light gathering ability of a 50+mm objective, with multiple changeable reticles (which all maintain common zero) in a compact light-weight highly-durable shock-proof, waterproof, fog-proof package with daylight, night vision and thermal capabilities, a built-in fully-automatic rangefinder and integrated ballistic calculator, no need for batteries, with a lifetime replacement warranty -- and preferably costing under $100.

[n4aof]

Originally Posted by Don Quijote
Target location and ID: small binoculars or LRF (7X - 8X)
Anything past 350 - 400 yards: bolt action rifle, higher top end magnification (15X min), caliber not 223.

An AR is plenty capable at these ranges, especially with a LPVO.

The AR is "plenty capable" of punching paper or ringing steel at the ranges mentioned (although it gets iffy very soon beyond), but note that he didn't actually say anything about "not AR" -- he said "not 223" -- and he's right, at least for serious work

[horsefighting]

I think the best all around, as a lot of guys here have already said, a decent variable power optic. I've got a 14.5 in AR with a Trijicon Accupoint 1-6x with mildot crosshair. No batteries to worry about, a little on the heavy side (mitigate with lightweight accessories), but with the ability to shoot close up and then also make hits at 400 is money.

[nick84]

At first I thought my pick my be bending the rules a little, but if people can go with red dot and magnifier, I think I can offer my pick: If I had to choose absolutely one for the rest of all time with unknown scenarios, I am taking a 2.5x10 with a side or top mounted red dot. The LPVOs coming out these days seem awesome, I have some time on the Razor and love it. But for all scenarios unknown, I like the higher magnification for target inspection or ID at longer ranges. I realize that people can argue binoculars for this, but nothing beats the convenience of looking through your higher magnification scope to see if that shadow in a window could be a threat, or that pile of trash in the road has wires running out from it, etc. While this choice obviously carries weight over a red dot, it isn't that much more than a 1x6 or 1x8.

Caveat: Some hands on experience with the NF 1x8 could possible get me to change my mind here, but this is what I'm going with for now.