Which reticle for Schmidt & Bender 5x25x56?

[mickeyjr308]

Hi M4 team,

I am planning on purchasing a S&B PMII 5x25x56 Mrad FFP DT scope for my PGW Coyote 308Win Rifle, Which of these reticles would you recommend F4L Fein or the H59?
Right now I have a Leupold Mk4 3.5x10x40 MilDot scope and have had great Hits to 885M with 178gr handloads.
Main use for the rifle will be target shooting, Hunting, my Buddies want me to try PRS style matches.

Thank You In Advance,
MickeyJr308.

[pointblank4445]

Hi M4 team,

I am planning on purchasing a S&B PMII 5x25x56 Mrad FFP DT scope for my PGW Coyote 308Win Rifle, Which of these reticles would you recommend F4L Fein or the H59?
Right now I have a Leupold Mk4 3.5x10x40 MilDot scope and have had great Hits to 885M with 178gr handloads.
Main use for the rifle will be target shooting, Hunting, my Buddies want me to try PRS style matches.

Thank You In Advance,
MickeyJr308.

If you can score hit at 885m with a 10x, you don't need the added bulk of the 5-25x56 (in my opinion). If you're doing it for the S&B rollercoaster pricing, I get it but performance wise, you can find a better fit.

The P4F (fein) is great for when you spend a bunch of time at the top end of your magnification. If you want to do PRS, you won't be there as much as you'd think. The fein is easy to lose on lower magnification. The regular P4 is a bit thick and covers too much at top end. The MSR is actually the happy medium between the two and my preferred reticle.

H59...There are a lot of great shooters using Horus reticles. They aren't great because they use Horus though...and there are a lot of Horus cheerleaders out there that can't get over that fact. There are pro's and con's to every reticle design and the Horus/X-mas tree designs are no different.

The basic test for any reticle is to listen to your first impression. If you/your brain perceives it as busy/complicated/confusing...that's a clue. If you fine it intuitive and pleasing and easy to decipher, it probably is.

[mickeyjr308]

Hi PointBlank4445,

Thank you for the Great Advise, I checked out the MSR Reticle and as you stated a Happy Medium, clean not cluttered Reticle.

Best Regards,
MickeyJr308

[Vegasshooter]

I have had a couple of S&B scopes, and still have my 3-20 H2CMR reticle. The 5-25 was a Gen II XR. I liked it pretty well until I started getting serious about shooting competition. When shooting comps, the H59 is fantastic. My reasoning is this: there are usually stages that require you to “set and forget” your scope. In other words, you cannot dial once the clock starts. The H59 shines there. I can set my dial for my first shot, and hold from there really easy. The other reason is when you have to make 6-8 hits at different distances in 90 seconds from less than ideal positions, FOR ME, I can’t dial every shot. The H59 is perfect in that arena. Again....FOR ME.

I also have a 6.5 GAP 10 that I use an ATACR 4-16 on. Same reticle on each gun makes it super simple to remember.

I really like the H2CMR reticle for an all around. It’s not too busy, but it definitely allows some solid holds, and has .2 mil wind holds on the center line. Very solid as a dial up scope, but accurate wind holds.

The Gen II XR is also a good all around reticle. Heck, Tangent Theta has been selling them as their only reticle, and guys still use them.

The above are just my opinions on scopes I have personally used and shot. For a good all around, it’s up to you and what you are going to do.
Hope this helps a little

[pointblank4445]

I couldn't disagree more that a basic test for anything of use is first impressions., book by it's cover and all...

IMO the MSR is a artifact of old mildot design with very rough 1/2 mil hash marks oddly with fine hash marks just for ranging (optimized to medium range competitions where ranging through scope important but holdovers aren't?). So slow imprecise 1990's dial up and wind solutions, meh

I can teach a knucklehead assaulter to use a SPG-9 grid, a xmas tree or other horus type reticle, on whatever weapon, and have ELR hits inside an hour. An enthusiast without multitudes of other disciplines to train in should be fine.

I'm not a Tremor 2 or 3 fan, although solid for med distance rapid fire, and would trend to a H59.

Also, I have never wanted less magnification ability at distance. the 5-25 S&B is big but not absurd at least on 338 I use.

Be advised I'm not a PSR match guy and some feature sets and form factors may be optimized for the rules of that game.

Regarding some of the features of the MSR, I don't disagree. My preference toward it is largely in the context of reticle thickness in regards to magnification range of intended use (often 14-20x).

Regarding the first impression thing, largely has to do with the setup, size, orientation of the subtensions. If one finds them difficult to read or not in a logical orientation to their perspective, that is unlikely to change without considerable effort. Example being I like the SKMR3 and MPCT2 reticle layouts. Could I live with Mil-XT or Gen 3 XR?...yes, but I can map/locate points on the former a little quicker (without counting). But long before that, I would've had to decide between (in order) the Kahles, ZCO, NF or TT before even getting to the reticle.

Tis the blessing/curse of the commercial end user.

[andy t]

My approach was to get whatever reticle was in a scope that I could get a great deal on. As such I ended up with H2CMR and Gen 2 XR. I also had a Steiner with MSR. In my opinion, for known distance range shooting, it doesn't matter. When it comes to competitions, opinions wary. I did one and only comp with MSR and I dialed as I think most people did.