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Thread: Franklin Armory blacklists InRangeTV at SHOT Show 2019

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottryan View Post
    That is called marketing bullshit.

    Everyone knows its bullshit including the Mossberg lady.

    What did you expect her to say?

    "We came out with this product to skirt the NFA and sell short shotguns to people"

    How do you think that is going to be twisted when the liberal media gets ahold of a soundbite like that? And runs a 60 Minutes episode about how Mossberg is selling "sawed off shotguns" and "exploiting a loophole in the law."
    I get it. I know they have to be careful how they market stuff.
    I think most firearms savvy people know what the Shockwave is and is not suited for.
    Part of my frustration, not with Mossberg, or Franklin Armory, but just in general...is I'm tired of playing semantics and word games ("modern sporting rifle" etc..) when it comes to guns.
    The NFA is stupid and should be circumvented at every opportunity, just on principle. But yeah, I know in the current climate, a company that wants to stay in business or avoid a PR nightmare has to handle things differently.
    I think InRange may have been looking at the Shockwave from the perspective of "what about the uninformed consumers who take Mossberg at their word and buy the Shockwave as their ultimate HD weapon?"

  2. #52
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    An interviewer can be polite and still add counter comments later. They don’t have to be in your face with the firearms rep. As gun enthusiasts we should model professionalism, and be courteous to one another. God knows there are plenty of antis willing to be rude and sarcastic toward us. I think it would be irresponsible for an “analyst” to simple accept the marketing line. But Ian could have politely probed in the interview, let her say her piece and then later in the vid add his own observations and advice.
    It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! ... Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry in an address at St. John’s Church, Richmond, Virginia, on March 23, 1775.

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by NWPilgrim View Post
    I think it would be irresponsible for an “analyst” to simple accept the marketing line.

    If this was a review of an automobile, refrigerator, or some other consumer crap, that would be fine.

    A firearm is a politically charged item. The analyst needs to know why it is being marketed a certain way.
    "Not every thing on Earth requires an aftermarket upgrade." demigod/markm

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by NWPilgrim View Post
    An interviewer can be polite and still add counter comments later. They don’t have to be in your face with the firearms rep. As gun enthusiasts we should model professionalism, and be courteous to one another. God knows there are plenty of antis willing to be rude and sarcastic toward us. I think it would be irresponsible for an “analyst” to simple accept the marketing line. But Ian could have politely probed in the interview, let her say her piece and then later in the vid add his own observations and advice.
    Completely agree.
    "There is a savage beast in every man, and when you hand that man a sword or spear and send him forth to war, the beast stirs." -George R.R. Martin, A Storm of Swords

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottryan View Post
    That is called marketing bullshit.

    Everyone knows its bullshit including the Mossberg lady.

    What did you expect her to say?

    "We came out with this product to skirt the NFA and sell short shotguns to people"

    How do you think that is going to be twisted when the liberal media gets ahold of a soundbite like that? And runs a 60 Minutes episode about how Mossberg is selling "sawed off shotguns" and "exploiting a loophole in the law."
    LOL.

    Like they have with bump stocks?

    Nobody in the industry making bump stocks ever said that they were for simulating full-auto fire, but that's what the media has run with. Believe it or not, the media and gun grabbers don't need any help from the gun industry thinking up reasons for why the gun industry is amoral, immoral, and should be lobbied out of existence.

    Quote Originally Posted by scottryan View Post
    If this was a review of an automobile, refrigerator, or some other consumer crap, that would be fine.

    A firearm is a politically charged item. The analyst needs to know why it is being marketed a certain way.
    No, you're right. There's absolutely no need to combat the vast amounts of horseshit information in the firearms industry. I'm sure Taurus's marketing of the Judge has totally resulted in it being banned and nobody has ever been harmed by thinking that their Taurus Judge was, as they were told by the Taurus ad material and the morons behind the sales counter, basically a 12-gauge they could fit in their pocket.

    " For Augustus, and after him Tiberius, more interested in establishing and increasing their own power than in promoting the public good, began to disarm the Roman people (in order to make them more passive under their tyranny)[.] "
    - Niccolò Machiavelli, 1520 -
    Dell'Arte della Guerra (The Art of War)

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Circle_10 View Post
    I get it. I know they have to be careful how they market stuff.
    I think most firearms savvy people know what the Shockwave is and is not suited for.
    Part of my frustration, not with Mossberg, or Franklin Armory, but just in general...is I'm tired of playing semantics and word games ("modern sporting rifle" etc..) when it comes to guns.
    The NFA is stupid and should be circumvented at every opportunity, just on principle. But yeah, I know in the current climate, a company that wants to stay in business or avoid a PR nightmare has to handle things differently.
    I think InRange may have been looking at the Shockwave from the perspective of "what about the uninformed consumers who take Mossberg at their word and buy the Shockwave as their ultimate HD weapon?"
    I think that may be close to it based on a recent Forgotten Weapons. Ian mentioned being rude to a rep from a company offering a new belt fed upper. he stated the rib grabbed him while he was walking along and he figured it would be not so hot like most other belt-fed uppers, but upon further review he found it to be something new and interesting.

    I still don't think they really gave the Shockwave a fair Shake by using the standard 18.5 in with standard pistol grip and while not using it in a confined space.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by MountainRaven View Post
    LOL.

    Like they have with bump stocks?

    Nobody in the industry making bump stocks ever said that they were for simulating full-auto fire, but that's what the media has run with. Believe it or not, the media and gun grabbers don't need any help from the gun industry thinking up reasons for why the gun industry is amoral, immoral, and should be lobbied out of existence.
    A mainstream firearms manufacturer did not invent and sell bumpstocks.


    No, you're right. There's absolutely no need to combat the vast amounts of horseshit information in the firearms industry. I'm sure Taurus's marketing of the Judge has totally resulted in it being banned and nobody has ever been harmed by thinking that their Taurus Judge was, as they were told by the Taurus ad material and the morons behind the sales counter, basically a 12-gauge they could fit in their pocket.
    The Taurus Judge does not skirt the edge of the NFA.
    "Not every thing on Earth requires an aftermarket upgrade." demigod/markm

  8. #58
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    Did Mossberg really come up with the Shockwave idea? I am thinking that was someone else's idea and they got Mossberg to run off a batch of 14" birds head 500s or 590s a few years ahead of the "Shockwave" by name.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottryan View Post
    The Taurus Judge does not skirt the edge of the NFA.
    Neither do bumpstocks or pistol braces.
    " For Augustus, and after him Tiberius, more interested in establishing and increasing their own power than in promoting the public good, began to disarm the Roman people (in order to make them more passive under their tyranny)[.] "
    - Niccolò Machiavelli, 1520 -
    Dell'Arte della Guerra (The Art of War)

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by MountainRaven View Post
    Neither do bumpstocks or pistol braces.
    We know that and recognize it but the GDP (generally dumb public) do not.

    Part of the reason firearm education should be an annual public school course that would require parents to sign an opt out like sex ed if they protest.

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