Basic Question: Does a Rifle Length Gas System Need a Rifle Length Buffer Tube?

[docdubz]

Ive been trying to figure out an answer to this question for a little bit now. Got a pretty decent 20" hbar build ordered, but I can not for the life of me figure out what is going on with the buffer/stock portion of the industry. Theres like a total of 6 full sized fixed stocks available compared to the 6 million mall ninja collapsible stocks on offer. And then there is the A5 buffer stuff. The best I can tell is its mainly being used to give carbine/mid gas systems access to a rifle spring. And everything that I can find on them is stuff like "it works perfectly fine" or "as long as you get the 'good spring' it works perfectly fine". But, that sounds awfully relative to me, how does "perfectly fine" compared to "40 years of proven reliability".

Is it that the A5 makes a decent range toy or can it actually be depended upon?

[vicious_cb]

Ive been trying to figure out an answer to this question for a little bit now. Got a pretty decent 20" hbar build ordered, but I can not for the life of me figure out what is going on with the buffer/stock portion of the industry. Theres like a total of 6 full sized fixed stocks available compared to the 6 million mall ninja collapsible stocks on offer. And then there is the A5 buffer stuff. The best I can tell is its mainly being used to give carbine/mid gas systems access to a rifle spring. And everything that I can find on them is stuff like "it works perfectly fine" or "as long as you get the 'good spring' it works perfectly fine". But, that sounds awfully relative to me, how does "perfectly fine" compared to "40 years of proven reliability".

Is it that the A5 makes a decent range toy or can it actually be depended upon?

The A5 system is superior to both the carbine and rifle receiver extensions as per USMC reliability testing.

[AndyLate]

Ive been trying to figure out an answer to this question for a little bit now. Got a pretty decent 20" hbar build ordered, but I can not for the life of me figure out what is going on with the buffer/stock portion of the industry. Theres like a total of 6 full sized fixed stocks available compared to the 6 million mall ninja collapsible stocks on offer. And then there is the A5 buffer stuff. The best I can tell is its mainly being used to give carbine/mid gas systems access to a rifle spring. And everything that I can find on them is stuff like "it works perfectly fine" or "as long as you get the 'good spring' it works perfectly fine". But, that sounds awfully relative to me, how does "perfectly fine" compared to "40 years of proven reliability".

Is it that the A5 makes a decent range toy or can it actually be depended upon?

Collapsible stocks are not just for mall ninjas. I just got home from the range where it was beneficial to shorten the length of pull on a scoped AR to allow my small statured friend to shoot it comfortably and to make up for the warm clothes I was wearing when I shot it. The adjustable stock also allows my 6'5" brother to shoot my AR without looking like he's shooting a toy gun.

My body armor days are behind me, but I know adjustable LOP stocks are a boon to the LE and Mil folks who wear it.

I use a 16" and a 20" rifle upper on a lower running the A-5 system with a standard rifle spring and A5H2 (standard) buffer. Both uppers are perfectly reliable with ammunition from mild handloads to Mil spec M193 and green tip. The A5 system works, period.

Your 20" HBAR will run reliably on a carbine RE with H2, H3 or H6 buffer, an A5 RE with an A5H2 buffer, or with a standard rifle RE and buffer.

The most obvious functional difference is that a rifle RE limits you to a fixed LOP.

[Iraqgunz]

Using Mall ninja and M4 collapsible stocks together ruin any chances for someone to take you serious.

Ive been trying to figure out an answer to this question for a little bit now. Got a pretty decent 20" hbar build ordered, but I can not for the life of me figure out what is going on with the buffer/stock portion of the industry. Theres like a total of 6 full sized fixed stocks available compared to the 6 million mall ninja collapsible stocks on offer. And then there is the A5 buffer stuff. The best I can tell is its mainly being used to give carbine/mid gas systems access to a rifle spring. And everything that I can find on them is stuff like "it works perfectly fine" or "as long as you get the 'good spring' it works perfectly fine". But, that sounds awfully relative to me, how does "perfectly fine" compared to "40 years of proven reliability".

Is it that the A5 makes a decent range toy or can it actually be depended upon?

[docdubz]

The A5 system is superior to both the carbine and rifle receiver extensions as per USMC reliability testing.

I just tried googling that and Im getting goose eggs. You happen to have a citation?

Collapsible stocks are not just for mall ninjas. I just got home from the range where it was beneficial to shorten the length of pull on a scoped AR to allow my small statured friend to shoot it comfortably and to make up for the warm clothes I was wearing when I shot it. The adjustable stock also allows my 6'5" brother to shoot my AR without looking like he's shooting a toy gun.

My body armor days are behind me, but I know adjustable LOP stocks are a boon to the LE and Mil folks who wear it.

I use a 16" and a 20" rifle upper on a lower running the A-5 system with a standard rifle spring and A5H2 (standard) buffer. Both uppers are perfectly reliable with ammunition from mild handloads to Mil spec M193 and green tip. The A5 system works, period.

Your 20" HBAR will run reliably on a carbine RE with H2, H3 or H6 buffer, an A5 RE with an A5H2 buffer, or with a standard rifle RE and buffer.

The most obvious functional difference is that a rifle RE limits you to a fixed LOP.

Limited to a fixed minimum length of pull but not maximum. I dont even really get the purpose of collapsible stocks to be honest, I mean theres the argument for cqc and mounted patrols but I never had any problem shortstocking my rifle. So if thats the 'most obvious' difference then it sounds like my assessment was correct.

Using Mall ninja and M4 collapsible stocks together ruin any chances for someone to take you serious.

You'd love my opinion of aimpoints then.

[vicious_cb]

ESED DTR10-JXPLN-055
Detailed test report
Reliability Comparison
M16A4, M16A4 with H6 Buffer, M16A4 with VLTOR Stock Assembly.
January 2010

[1168]

I just tried googling that and Im getting goose eggs. You happen to have a citation?



Limited to a fixed minimum length of pull but not maximum. I dont even really get the purpose of collapsible stocks to be honest, I mean theres the argument for cqc and mounted patrols but I never had any problem shortstocking my rifle. So if thats the 'most obvious' difference then it sounds like my assessment was correct.



You'd love my opinion of aimpoints then.

What exactly are you trying to prove?

[docdubz]

ESED DTR10-JXPLN-055
Detailed test report
Reliability Comparison
M16A4, M16A4 with H6 Buffer, M16A4 with VLTOR Stock Assembly.
January 2010

Thats interesting. The closest thing I found to that was forum chatter about the h6 buffer failing to meet requirements. Ive been looking into these buffers for a while and thats the first decent bit of info (as in actual data) that Ive come across, thanks.

[AndyLate]

My Troll Fu is weaker than IGs.

To Doc I must say:

Yet they will ban thee with much cherishing.
Good night, good night! parting is such
sweet sorrow,
That I shall say good night and watch the hammer fall.

[docdubz]

My Troll Fu is weaker than IGs.

To Doc I must say:

Yet they will ban thee with much cherishing.
Good night, good night! parting is such
sweet sorrow,
That I shall say good night and watch the hammer fall.

Having an apparently unpopular opinion is trolling? If you refer to my reply above you would see that I am/was looking for actual data rather than anecdotes about how great it is. If I wanted to troll Id have said something about this place compared to you know where. And, since Ive already been accused of trolling I might as well... For as much of a paid shill fest as that place is at least they can take someone stating they dont like collapsible stocks without accusations of trolling.