G&R Tactical

View Poll Results: Do the benefits of the VLTOR A5 system outweigh the downsides?

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  • Yes

    90 67.16%
  • No

    27 20.15%
  • I'm too confused to know

    17 12.69%
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Thread: I'm over the A5 system, do you think its worth it?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sry0fcr View Post
    The A5 is worth it if you have a need for it: 1.) If you're trying to run a collapsible stock on a rifle gas system
    I find the A5H2 buffer is more forgiving and gives a smoother recoil impulse than an H2 buffer regardless of barrel or gas system length, suppressed or unsuppressed.

    2.) If you have an over-gassed system that a standard buffer weight can't help
    Define "standard". Do you mean the CAR buffer most econo brands us? The H buffer Colt uses in their commercial 6920s? The H2 buffer used in the M4A1 Colt supplies to the military? Or the original rifle buffer.

    When experimenting with gas drive, I found that buffer weight does almost nothing to correct the problems of over gassing. When testing to see what happens with the gas block turned down to smallest setting that still gave full function, I found the CAR, H & H2 all used the same gas setting. Yet recoil was harshest with the CAR buffer and smoothest with the H2.

    3.) If you like to fiddle-**** with your guns
    After doing just this, I've come to the conclusion that it saves time just to start with an A5 RE assembly with the A5H2 buffer & Sprinco green spring because you'll likely end there.

    most will probably fall into category 3 who should probably look into a different gas system (midlength, intermediate) or a different gas porting instead and solve the problem at it's root.
    This is quite true. If the gas drive isn't right, no amount of fussing with buffers & springs will solve anything.
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  2. #22
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    I think if you run everything suppressed, the gain is much more noticeable and valuable. And I run everything with a can. When I bought my SR15, it ran perfect, with can I had lock back issues with Colt 20 rounders ( which are know to have weak springs so I found out) A5, problem solved.

    They are worth it to me, nice but not necessary is how I would catagorize the A5.

    PB
    "Air Force / Policeman / Fireman / Man of God / Friend of mine / R.I.P. Steve Lamy"

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1168 View Post
    My hypothesis is that the A5 results can be reproduced without the A5 RE.

    Comments and suggestions welcome.
    I think your hypothesis is correct. There is no doubt that some combination of spring and buffer will replicate the results achieved by the A5 system.

    The question, at least to me, will the cost be comparable?

    I can get into the BCM A5 for 99.50; their Carbine RE kit runs 57.95, but doesn't come with a QD endplate. So if I compare prices of their std end plate ($4.00) and their QD end plate ($16.95) their is a $12.95 price differential. Either take that amount from the A5 kit or add that amount to the Carbine kit, the results are the same, a $28.60 price differential.

    Both those systems come with the 'basic' buffers - A5H0 (3.8oz) and Carbine (3.0oz). We can get those weights together by replacing the Carbine buffer with an H buffer ($22.95 at BCM) but there is still the spring difference. Some have talked of using the G Super 42 but that comes with a proprietary buffer so you need the combo @ $65.00 to get to A5HO. Other folks talk of using a Springco Blue @$19.95.

    The bottom line is using a Super 42 kit sets you back $65.00; using a H buffer and Springco Spring (Red or Blue) will set you back $42.90. Both options are above the initial $28.60 price differential.

    You can go about building the systems in different ways, but to make a fair comparison you should source parts from the same vendor as much as possible, and make it plug and play.

    A final thought. I use a heavy rifle buffer (home built) in my service rifle. If I switched from the A2 stock to an adjustable, I could go with the A5 and a A5H4 buffer at essentially the same weight for $59.95
    or go with the carbine system and a PWS H4 buffer for $89.95 plus spring. Again, the price of components would seemingly make the A5 a better deal.
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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by MistWolf View Post
    If the gas drive isn't right, no amount of fussing with buffers & springs will solve anything.
    I won't say that the TDP is wrong, I just don't think that it's right. From everything that I've been able to gather over the years almost all of the issues with M4 patterened guns is related to or a result of an over gassed system (porting & dwell time).
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaykayyy
    And to the guys whining about spending more on training, and relying less on the hardware, you just sound like your [sic] trying to make yourself feel superior.

  5. #25
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    Meanwhile at the range--
    GET IN YOUR BUBBLE!

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sry0fcr View Post
    If you're trying to run a collapsible stock on a rifle gas system
    Is a rifle or A5 RE, spring and buffer really necessary with a rifle gas gun?

    The SME posts I have read here lead me to believe that the A5 either shines with SBRs and suppressed guns or that the system is superior across the board.

    Andy

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyLate View Post
    Is a rifle or A5 RE, spring and buffer really necessary with a rifle gas gun?

    The SME posts I have read here lead me to believe that the A5 either shines with SBRs and suppressed guns or that the system is superior across the board.

    Andy
    Necessary? I dunno. Seems to be what the A5 was originally designed for. Makes sense that longer travel and a potentially heavier buffer would slow things down/smooth things out in other guns.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaykayyy
    And to the guys whining about spending more on training, and relying less on the hardware, you just sound like your [sic] trying to make yourself feel superior.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sry0fcr View Post
    Necessary? I dunno. Seems to be what the A5 was originally designed for. Makes sense that longer travel and a potentially heavier buffer would slow things down/smooth things out in other guns.
    I agree that is why the A5 came to be (and why I have one in my single rifle).

    I'm not sure I understood what you said, but the bolt carrier travels the same distance with Rifle, A5, and Carbine receiver extensions and buffers.

    Andy

  9. #29
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    I assembled three A5 buffers from 4.5-7ish oz. While the A5 system is softer shooting than a carbine H system, the varied weights didn't seem to make much difference within the A5 system, in my 16" SR15 and 11.5" BCM SBR.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1168 View Post
    I think there’s something here.

    Have you tested with roughly equivalent weight buffers, A5 vs carbine? As in A5H1 vs H2?
    Yes.....

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