.308 Win reloading and brass questions

[lsllc]

Mark, if you’re getting loose primer pockets on Lapua brass after 3-5 firings, time to work up a new load! That is a waste, man!

If you say you need better performance, pick up a 6.5 Creedmoor or a .300 Win mag.

You’ll certainly find that the little performance increase you’re getting probably doesn’t show up down range much at all. Say you get 50 FPS more pushing it that hard, what does that calculate to in wind drift at 1,000? 0.05 mils?


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[TxRaptor]

I am not new to reloading, just new to reloading for bolt action. I plan to neck size after fire forming brass to my chamber. The body die would be for initial sizing to fit my chamber or for new/new to me brass followed by neck sizing to have uniform neck tension. I was hoping to make use of the brass I have on hand seeing as I have about 400 pieces of the W-W Super and 200 of the LC LR Match. Looking at picking up a Redding body die and Lee neck collet die. Deciding on whether I want to use a Wilson seating die with an arbor press or just use a standard seating die in my press. I am open to other die/setup suggestions.

Other than varying internal case volume and crimped primer pockets, any issues in using the LC LR Match brass?
Other than thinner neck material, any issues in using the W-W Super brass?

[lsllc]

I wouldn’t waste my money on an arbor press or such a die. Neck sizing will not provide more uniform neck tension. It does the same thing as a FL die as far as what it does to the neck. You cannot outside size the neck of your brass and inside size the neck of the brass in one process and expect uniformity unless you’ve first neck-turned the brass for consistent thickness. This may be a little more involved for a non-competitive shooter.

Almost sounds like you’re wanting benchest techniques and accuracy, if so, you’ll chase your tail with either brass you’re mentioning.

The common process for benchrest and F-Class these days is FL size with minimal shoulder bump with the expander removed. Follow that up with a carbide neck mandrel. That will get you more consistent internal neck diameter and thus neck tension. Unless you’re turning necks, the internal diameter is the part of the neck you want to focus on as it is what touches the bullet. External neck diameter is the focus of neck-turning. This typically requires a chamber cut with a custom reamer for a specific brand brass turned to a specific neck diameter.

I have been reloading precision ammunition on a progressive press the last year or so because I’m so busy anymore. I use a five station press. I run through a universal decapping die, then prime on the down stroke, next an S-Type Redding die with TiN bushing with no decapping rod or expander, then on to a Sinclair carbide neck mandrel, then I have a powder die modified for a funnel, I throw with an auto dispenser/trickler, then a Redding Competition seating die or Forster benchrest

I’m getting 0.001-0.002” runout in my reloaded rounds. I’ve been able to consistently score above 190-195/200 at 600. I’ve even managed some 196s and 198s.

This process is working well for me with .308, 6mm Creedmoor, 6.5 Creedmoor, and .260 Remington. I don’t recommend this with .223 however because it’s difficult to get consistent charges with extruded powders with such a small case on the powder die.


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[markm]

Mark, if you’re getting loose primer pockets on Lapua brass after 3-5 firings, time to work up a new load! That is a waste, man!

We run hot ammo... brass life be damned.

If you say you need better performance, pick up a 6.5 Creedmoor or a .300 Win mag.

We are indeed shooting two 6.5 cm guns and five 300WM guns.

[markm]

Other than varying internal case volume and crimped primer pockets, any issues in using the LC LR Match brass?
Other than thinner neck material, any issues in using the W-W Super brass?

No issues with LC LR brass. I love it. My problems with WW brass was that the collet doesn't squeeze the necks down the same as the beefier brass flavors. And I didn't want to modify the madrell to fit brass I don't like in the first place.

Your body die will still be needed every few firings. At least in my experience... the bolt gets hard to close if I don't size the brass back a little. I just run the body die every time on all bolt ammo so I don't lose track. My die is set to our guns and usually my ammo won't chamber in guy's guns that are new.

[markm]

I wouldn’t waste my money on an arbor press or such a die. Neck sizing will not provide more uniform neck tension. It does the same thing as a FL die as far as what it does to the neck. You cannot outside size the neck of your brass and inside size the neck of the brass in one process and expect uniformity unless you’ve first neck-turned the brass for consistent thickness.

With the LEE collet neck die, you can indeed neck size off the inside of the case neck. That's what I run and gets me, by far, the least neck runout.

For what it's worth, we sorted off the worst bullet runout rounds in a few boxes of factory ammo. (I'm talking like .007-.010+) and shot them against the straightest rounds. These were SMK (tangent ogive) bullets. There was no accuracy difference. That said, I still like minimizing runout as it's a reflection of a poor process.

[lsllc]

We run hot ammo... brass life be damned.

If you know the consequences of your actions and don’t mind, you do you.


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[lsllc]

With the LEE collet neck die, you can indeed neck size off the inside of the case neck. That's what I run and gets me, by far, the least neck runout.

For what it's worth, we sorted off the worst bullet runout rounds in a few boxes of factory ammo. (I'm talking like .007-.010+) and shot them against the straightest rounds. These were SMK (tangent ogive) bullets. There was no accuracy difference. That said, I still like minimizing runout as it's a reflection of a poor process.

No accuracy difference in what context?

Groups at 100 yards?

Hitting steel at 600?



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[markm]

If you know the consequences of your actions and don’t mind, you do you.

Yeah.. I just cull them out as they get weak. We started out with like 300-400 pieces. I'd guess 20 or so have given up the ghost.

No accuracy difference in what context?

Groups at 100 yards?

Hitting steel at 600?

These were just fired at 100m on the high power range. Unfortunately both our current spot an the high power range have sub optimal wind conditions to draw good conclusions at "real" distance. The HP range at Rio Salado here in AZ often has horrible cross winds.

We shoot in it, and it is what it is. But comparative accuracy testing at distance is challenging.

[lsllc]

For comparing high run-out rounds to low run-out, the difference I notice is the velocity ES. Lots of those “wind” misses are often elevation.


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