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Thread: Why Running (Still) Sucks...

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillBrink View Post
    Some good intel in those links. Risk to benefit compared to other options, running sucks. However, I did offer best practices for improving benefits for those who enjoy running.
    Probably the best advice under the circumstances.

    My personal opinion is that if you think back to when mankind was roaming the plains in animal skins, running was what you did to get away from predators, or to attack. In other words: Short bursts of high intensity.

    Most of the time, a primitive human would have walked from place to place when not in danger.

    A human is made to walk.

    It's anecdotal, I know, but my girlfriend is a nurse and she constantly cautions me about the number of knee problems she sees and invariably it seems to be in runners.

    Just sayin'.
    Last edited by Doc Safari; 07-12-19 at 10:45.

  2. #12
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    Some thoughts based on my experience and understanding of exercise research studies:

    Agree that running is subpar for weight loss compared to RT, but that doesn’t mean you can’t do both for different reasons.

    I strength train bc I like it and I know it’s king for body comp. And let’s face it, the stronger you are, the more capable you are in everyday life.

    I also run (and do heavy pack hikes) because it translates the best for me when I go out for a week+ in the mountains chasing elk. There’s the specific reason I run, but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t feel better when I’m incorporating running and lifting at the same time. Heart rate and my ability to breathe under stress are greatly improved. And yes I know you can do this to an extent with weight training techniques, but I still don’t think it translates quite as well.

    My running consists of long(er) steady state training with 8:00 or better pace and I also incorporate interval running at various intensities. I really do try to run the full gambit across my weekly/monthly exercise schedule. Weekly mileage is usually around 10 miles when I’m consistent, so I’m not doing a ton.

    Another thing to consider, if all you do is lift, your body will be pretty well adapted to that and you WILL see results by incorporating any type of cardio activity, including running. Same is especially true vice versa.

    Last thing, if you’re the type of person who is super highly stressed out, don’t sleep well, and have a sh*t diet, then high intensity anything isn’t for you. Get your life stressors in order first before you add on HIT unless you want to tank your body and metabolism.
    Last edited by Ironman8; 07-12-19 at 10:54.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Safari View Post
    Probably the best advice under the circumstances.

    My personal opinion is that if you think back to when mankind was roaming the plains in animal skins, running was what you did to get away from predators, or to attack. In other words: Short bursts of high intensity.

    Most of the time, a primitive human would have walked from place to place when not in danger.

    A human is made to walk.

    It's anecdotal, I know, but my girlfriend is a nurse and she constantly cautions me about the number of knee problems she sees and invariably it seems to be in runners.

    Just sayin'.
    A number of recent studies suggest running is not hard on the joints, but I remain highly skeptical of those findings personally, and suspect studies were biased by skinny runner weenies
    - Will

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    “Those who do not view armed self defense as a basic human right, ignore the mass graves of those who died on their knees at the hands of tyrants.”

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillBrink View Post
    A number of recent studies suggest running is not hard on the joints, but I remain highly skeptical of those findings personally, and suspect studies were biased by skinny runner weenies
    LOL. I think running on hard pavement may be a contributing factor. If all those runners could run on natural dirt it might be less damaging.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironman8 View Post
    Some thoughts based on my experience and understanding of exercise research studies:

    Agree that running is subpar for weight loss compared to RT, but that doesn’t mean you can’t do both for different reasons.

    I strength train bc I like it and I know it’s king for body comp. And let’s face it, the stronger you are, the more capable you are in everyday life.

    I also run (and do heavy pack hikes) because it translates the best for me when I go out for a week+ in the mountains chasing elk. There’s the specific reason I run, but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t feel better when I’m incorporating running and lifting at the same time. Heart rate and my ability to breathe under stress are greatly improved. And yes I know you can do this to an extent with weight training techniques, but I still don’t think it translates quite as well.

    My running consists of long(er) steady state training with 8:00 or better pace and I also incorporate interval running at various intensities. I really do try to run the full gambit across my weekly/monthly exercise schedule. Weekly mileage is usually around 10 miles when I’m consistent, so I’m not doing a ton.

    Another thing to consider, if all you do is lift, your body will be pretty well adapted to that and you WILL see results by incorporating any type of cardio activity, including running. Same is especially true vice versa.

    Last thing, if you’re the type of person who is super highly stressed out, don’t sleep well, and have a sh*t diet, then high intensity anything isn’t for you. Get your life stressors in order first before you add on HIT unless you want to tank your body and metabolism.
    Yeah I did low rep 3x5 heavy compound stuff for many years. I remember when I started it was the "gallon of milk a day" and all that mattered were the weights I was pulling, squatting, and pressing for 1RMs. I was taking energy pre-workouts and then stuff to sleep for recovery, and pretty much eating everything all the time. I used to eat like three McDoubles on the way home from the gym before cooking dinner.

    These days I generally try to run on the treadmill at least one mile at 7mph to warm up before lifting, and now it's just about all 5x12 stuff, even using cables and machines for a bunch of stuff.

    Overall I'm much healthier, which has a lot to do with not eating so much trash I'm sure, but the higher rep stuff mixed with the running seems to have my cardio and lung function doing well.

    Like the quoted post I do it all for functional strength and fitness. I find normal life tasks like hiking the AT, doing yard work, moving furniture around, or whatever, much easier now that it was when my 1RM was higher (along with my BF%).

  6. #16
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    Jogging does suck. I've never lost an ounce of weight doing it. But I still try to jog a few times of week because it's free cardio, and I work in some running within the jog.

    Working a job where I walked 10-15 miles per day in a warehouse, combined with some heavy lifting is the ONLY time in my life where I saw real, no BS weight loss. The problem is that walking enough to make any real difference takes a TON of time. You'd have to walk 3-4 hours per day. And who has that kind of time?
    "You people have too much time on your hands." - scottryan

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by markm View Post
    Jogging does suck. I've never lost an ounce of weight doing it. But I still try to jog a few times of week because it's free cardio, and I work in some running within the jog.

    Working a job where I walked 10-15 miles per day in a warehouse, combined with some heavy lifting is the ONLY time in my life where I saw real, no BS weight loss. The problem is that walking enough to make any real difference takes a TON of time. You'd have to walk 3-4 hours per day. And who has that kind of time?
    Exactly, and why HIIT, or better yet SIT, can be done in minimal time and is far more effective on every end point it's been compared. Read article, follow a few of the links, get results in minimum time.
    - Will

    General Performance/Fitness Advice for all

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    Performance/Fitness Advice For the Tactical Community

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    “Those who do not view armed self defense as a basic human right, ignore the mass graves of those who died on their knees at the hands of tyrants.”

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by markm View Post
    The problem is that walking enough to make any real difference takes a TON of time. You'd have to walk 3-4 hours per day. And who has that kind of time?
    Concur. I have enough to do at the ranch that first thing in the morning when it's cool I walk one to two miles around my perimeter to make sure all is well. Of course sometimes I don't finish the entire perimeter in one day. Then I'm doing other stuff. And I try to stay out of the heat. So that means right after sunrise and right after sundown is when I get my real exercise done. Everything else is just "takin' care o' business."

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillBrink View Post
    Personally, I think running – in the form of jogging – simply sucks for most things, and I’m not alone that assessment by many a qualified coach, but more on that later…
    Agree, and my own experience has borne that out. After h.s. in which I lifted and played 3 sports, life got busy and I tried running. It seemed to have very limited health benefit, although I'm an outdoors person and it just gives a huge mental lift to go out running--even in the rain in the PNW. For me, the run was always one of the high points of my day and it was fun to push yourself. Then I started to accumulate injuries from age and overuse, and nothing--not the R.I.C.E. regimen, not better shoes or insoles, not fancy exercises--would prevent it. Guess that God didn't build me to be a marathon guy. Plantar fasciitis (multiple bouts). Right knee pain. Shin splints. Lower right back pain. Enough already!

    I finally wised up, about 7 years ago I did some homework and switched to a program that might differ in the details, but follows the same principles that Will suggests. In short: prioritize strength training, and some kind of H.I.I.T training, over 'pure cardio' training by which I mean something like steady state running or just churning away endlessly at the same rate on a stationary bike or other contraption.

    Even if you're aging, you don't have to set out to be the hulk. Even light resistance training can help. If having back and other issues, you'll be amazed how a good physical therapist can set you up with some resistance training that will help improve things. For instance, I could believe how weak I was in the hip muscles despite lifting. And that was affecting my back. As for H.I.I.T, you can get away with even using some of the things you know, but you just have to do it differently. For instance I have a stationary bike for bad weather days. But instead of just churning away at the same speed for 30 minutes, I do maybe a 15-20 minute workout where I go at about 80-90% of max effort for short bursts, like 30 seconds, then drop back to a moderate pace to recover for maybe 60 seconds, and repeat. You can do the same types of things with running, if you like running. The catch for me, trying to do H.I.I.T with running, was that I was doing on pavement (not a lot of choice, I live in an urban area) and that brought back all the injuries related to pounding the pavement. So I'm pretty much done with running.

    Spot on Will. Thanks for these informative posts!

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by maximus83 View Post
    Agree, and my own experience has borne that out. After h.s. in which I lifted and played 3 sports, life got busy and I tried running. It seemed to have very limited health benefit, although I'm an outdoors person and it just gives a huge mental lift to go out running--even in the rain in the PNW. For me, the run was always one of the high points of my day and it was fun to push yourself. Then I started to accumulate injuries from age and overuse, and nothing--not the R.I.C.E. regimen, not better shoes or insoles, not fancy exercises--would prevent it. Guess that God didn't build me to be a marathon guy. Plantar fasciitis (multiple bouts). Right knee pain. Shin splints. Lower right back pain. Enough already!

    I finally wised up, about 7 years ago I did some homework and switched to a program that might differ in the details, but follows the same principles that Will suggests. In short: prioritize strength training, and some kind of H.I.I.T training, over 'pure cardio' training by which I mean something like steady state running or just churning away endlessly at the same rate on a stationary bike or other contraption.

    Even if you're aging, you don't have to set out to be the hulk. Even light resistance training can help. If having back and other issues, you'll be amazed how a good physical therapist can set you up with some resistance training that will help improve things. For instance, I could believe how weak I was in the hip muscles despite lifting. And that was affecting my back. As for H.I.I.T, you can get away with even using some of the things you know, but you just have to do it differently. For instance I have a stationary bike for bad weather days. But instead of just churning away at the same speed for 30 minutes, I do maybe a 15-20 minute workout where I go at about 80-90% of max effort for short bursts, like 30 seconds, then drop back to a moderate pace to recover for maybe 60 seconds, and repeat. You can do the same types of things with running, if you like running. The catch for me, trying to do H.I.I.T with running, was that I was doing on pavement (not a lot of choice, I live in an urban area) and that brought back all the injuries related to pounding the pavement. So I'm pretty much done with running.

    Spot on Will. Thanks for these informative posts!
    Glad they help.
    - Will

    General Performance/Fitness Advice for all

    www.BrinkZone.com

    Performance/Fitness Advice For the Tactical Community

    www.OptimalSWAT.com


    “Those who do not view armed self defense as a basic human right, ignore the mass graves of those who died on their knees at the hands of tyrants.”

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