Is GunBroker.com rigged?

[Arik]

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I can afford to buy the pistols at the added $800 that the shill added, that isn't the point. The point is that if people are artificially driving up prices without buying guns ever, then the auctions are rigged.

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Yes. Has been going on since eBay. With the first online auction product came the first online shill bidder.

People have been doing this with eBay cars/bikes since forever. Obviously it's not good but it's hard to stop because you don't know who's friends with whom.

[GH41]

Call it what you want but it is no more than the seller covering his own ass. I once listed a collectible pair of Remington shotguns on GB through a local guy who runs GB auctions for a living. I was fully prepared to buy the guns from myself if they didn't bring what I was looking for. What's wrong with that?

[Tx_Aggie]

Yes. Has been going on since eBay. With the first online auction product came the first online shill bidder.

People have been doing this with eBay cars/bikes since forever

The practice is probably as old as the concept of an auction. It's also fairly common at live, in-person auctions, and generally functions as a sort of hidden reserve price. I've seen horse sales where one person is bidding against the auctioneer, and not another buyer, without realizing it. The auctioneer is trying to get the bid up to the consignor's minimum selling price, but may have had to start well below it to get bidding started.

GB has a policy against shill bidding and will usually ban anyone caught participating in it. I've heard they track IP addresses to help in combating this, but I'm not sure how effective that is in the age of the VPN.

[Arik]

Call it what you want but it is no more than the seller covering his own ass. I once listed a collectible pair of Remington shotguns on GB through a local guy who runs GB auctions for a living. I was fully prepared to buy the guns from myself if they didn't bring what I was looking for. What's wrong with that?

Put a reserve

[Arik]

The practice is probably as old as the concept of an auction. It's also fairly common at live, in-person auctions, and generally functions as a sort of hidden reserve price (something eBay actually has available to sellers, GB not so much). I've seen horse sales where one person is bidding against the auctioneer, and not another buyer, without realizing it. The auctioneer is trying to get the bid up to the consignor's minimum selling price, but may have had to start well below it to get bidding started.

GB has a policy against shill bidding and will usually ban anyone caught participating in it. I've heard they track IP addresses to help in combating this, but I'm not sure how effective that is in the age of the VPN.

Exactly same thing happens at car auctions

[Tx_Aggie]

Call it what you want but it is no more than the seller covering his own ass. I once listed a collectible pair of Remington shotguns on GB through a local guy who runs GB auctions for a living. I was fully prepared to buy the guns from myself if they didn't bring what I was looking for. What's wrong with that?

Nothing, at least as far as I'm concerned.

To me that's no different than you sitting at a live auction and bidding on your own property. If you win, you still have to pay the auction company (and in your case probably the guy listing your items). It's just that the portion of the sale price that's left over after the fees and commission are paid comes back to you, and you get to keep your stuff.

It's a subtle difference, but I wouldn't say that's the same as the seller himself using a shill to bump the price.

But I've also come to expect a certain amount of shill bidding and agree with what some of the others have said - set an upper limit on price, and if the bid reaches that walk away.

Most of the bidding on no-reserve GB auctions happens at the last minute anyways, and the 15 minute rule pretty much makes eBay style bid sniping impossible, so there is plenty of time to respond to being outbid at the end of an auction..

[yoni]

I have bought many guns at GunBroker and have never had this happen till now. To have the same guy come in on 2 different sellers auctions and bid the price up and walk away, struck me as not being fair.

The only thing the auctions have in common was the pistols are the same model.

[Arik]

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The only thing the auctions have in common was the pistols are the same model.

Then maybe just bad luck. Guy could be like me. Here's my price and walk away. I win great! I don't, no loss to me!

[Averageman]

I've used GB a couple of times, I quit using it for exactly the reasons you explained.
There are legit Sellers, but I believe several of them use the system you described.
The final remedy was to watch the item closely and don't bid until about 25 seconds before the Auction ends.
I don't have time for that kind of malarkey.

[yoni]

Then maybe just bad luck. Guy could be like me. Here's my price and walk away. I win great! I don't, no loss to me!

But his record show no purchase or sales in the last 12 months.