With no LandCruiser 70, or Defender 90/110 in America, what

[Arik]

Jeep sold almost 250,000 Wranglers last year. And averaged about 190k a year each year for five years before that.
On par with Highlander sales, double RX sales.
And double 4Runner sales.
And five or ten times GX sales.

I am not saying more people want a frame on or hardcore unibody in line drivetrain with RWD, 4H, and 4L than there are that want a FWD based car platform with transverse drive train and AWD with a hatchback and ton for cup holders and lane assist and parking assist and 360 degree cameras etc.

I am saying a Japanese made LC70, Jeep Wrangler Unlimited, G wagon, Classic Defender looking boxy AWD vehicle with true 4 low frame on SUV in the 300hp/tq Range and 20-25mpg area, especially with Wrangler like removable doors, etc. would be a 250k plus a year hit.

And that FJ Cruiser sales and GX sales would actually have been much better if they stuck with the classic design type instead of going cartoonish curvey and luxuried up curvey respectively.

And that whatever new Defender and Bronco sales end up being, the less classic they end up being/looking, the less of their potential sales.

Basically, If a vehicle had the exact same features and specifications as brand new Jeep Wrangler Unlimited or trail rated Grand Cherokee,
But looked like a classic grand Cherokee, Prado, LC70, Patrol, Defender, Bronco, etc.
I hardly know anybody that does not want one.

Different customer base. Just about everyone I know has a GX/RX. 99% are bought for the wives and none would ever even consider anything Jeep/Dodge. None care about mpg or hp as far as numbers go. Be it 300hp or 400hp, it's not why the car was bought. Outside of that just about everywhere you look here in suburbia there's a Lexus SUV. I guarantee you that if Lexus made the GX AWD like the RX no one would notice or care. They're bought as an upscale luxury SUV, not for it's off road ability. People want luxury and bad weather capability.

[ramairthree]

Absolutely. Depending on age, number of kids, etc.
All our wives have AWD Acura, Lexus, Cayenne, etc. with some larger and smaller thrown in.

But all the guys, from 20s to 50s, have something more robust.
They either have a Jeep or 4Runner or Raptor or GX or LC.

Everyone basically describes
“If the Armada looked like a G Wagon,
If the GX looked like a classic Prado
If the 4Runner has removable doors and roof
If the new Defender looked like the old one
I hope they make a Raptor Bronco that looks like the old one
I wish the grand Cherokee looked like the commander
If wish their was a Wrangler that was made by Toyota
I wish the MDX was like the SLX was
Why can’t we get an LC 70
A 2004 looking discovery with a modern drivetrain would kick ass
The XTerra with the new Pathfinder or XTerra drivetrain would kick ass”


Definitely not the wife daily driver type.

[MountainRaven]

I bought my GX for its Land Cruiser lineage.

Because I'm a snob.

[Arik]

Absolutely. Depending on age, number of kids, etc.
All our wives have AWD Acura, Lexus, Cayenne, etc. with some larger and smaller thrown in.

But all the guys, from 20s to 50s, have something more robust.
They either have a Jeep or 4Runner or Raptor or GX or LC.

Everyone basically describes
“If the Armada looked like a G Wagon,
If the GX looked like a classic Prado
If the 4Runner has removable doors and roof
If the new Defender looked like the old one
I hope they make a Raptor Bronco that looks like the old one
I wish the grand Cherokee looked like the commander
If wish their was a Wrangler that was made by Toyota
I wish the MDX was like the SLX was
Why can’t we get an LC 70
A 2004 looking discovery with a modern drivetrain would kick ass
The XTerra with the new Pathfinder or XTerra drivetrain would kick ass”


Definitely not the wife daily driver type.

All the guys I know from 20-60 vary depending on personal tastes. But cars range from S550 to GX570 with a bunch of Teslas, Panamaras, and even a Bentley thrown in. Very few trucks and those are fully loaded Tundras.

Wives have G-Wagons, Cayennes, GX460s, Benz GL450s, Land Rovers RX350s, LS460s. My cousin has a twin turbo Cayenne because obviously she needs a twin turbo!

Obviously these cars aren't bought for their off road capability.

I'm the "black sheep" of the group. If it has 4 wheels and a steering wheel I'm good. Be it a 77 Bonneville, Smart for Two, or a rock crawler.

[ramairthree]

Granted,
While I am surrounded by affluent people,
The amount that have a background in military and SOF or that are non military and into kayaking and mountain biking etc. is disproportionate.
Yes, Ken always has a Mercedes coupe and CUV, and Keith is on his second Ferrari, and Mark is on a Maserati after a Ferrari,etc. from 20s to 50s it seems like only about ten percent are like that with the other 90% wishing you could waltz into a dealership and drive off in a new Defender 110 or LC70.

[flenna]

My 2007 Pathfinder with 270k+ miles was getting closer to giving up the ghost so I have been keeping my eyes open for a replacement. I found a one owner, clean car fax 2015 Xterra with 62k miles. Crawling underneath it looks like it had never been off road and there is not a ding anywhere on the body. The salesman said he has had it for a few weeks with lots of lookers but no buyers. I asked why and he said that folks today want a smooth driving, car like SUV and not the truck based body on frame. Anyway, I ended up buying it for well under retail including the lifetime power train warranty. I hope to get as many miles out of as I did my Pathfinder.

[armtx77]

My 2007 Pathfinder with 270k+ miles was getting closer to giving up the ghost so I have been keeping my eyes open for a replacement. I found a one owner, clean car fax 2015 Xterra with 62k miles. Crawling underneath it looks like it had never been off road and there is not a ding anywhere on the body. The salesman said he has had it for a few weeks with lots of lookers but no buyers. I asked why and he said that folks today want a smooth driving, car like SUV and not the truck based body on frame. Anyway, I ended up buying it for well under retail including the lifetime power train warranty. I hope to get as many miles out of as I did my Pathfinder.

Might want to see if it had the cooler bypass done to it. I THINK Nissan got the problem fixed prior to 2015, but a bad gasket, caused coolant to get into the transmission on the autos.

Lifetime on the drive train, nevermind.

[ramairthree]

The XTerra is a smart choice.

Say you’re looking for a dive year old frame on or at least inline drivetrain with true 4L unibody SUV with under about 75,000 miles on it. In a classic mid sized 4200 pound-ish vehicle.

So, you’re looking at 2014s. What is even out there? Unlike the mid 1990s to mid 2000s there are not a lot of true SUVs. New or recent used. Some are huge expenditures. Past the G Wagon, LX, and Land Cruiser, there are a ton of reasonable priced CUVs but not a lot of SUVs. And some of the options that are not crazy expensive are bigger and heavier.


You can get a well equipped XTerra or Grand Cherokee (trail rated AWD with 4L) for about 18k. About 500$ a year average repair and maintenance costs per year over the next six years on the Nissan and 700$ on the Jeep. That’s as good as it gets. The Pathfinder, Pilot, Explorer, etc. are all FWD based CUVs. If you want a manual transmission, that leaves the XTerra at this price point. Expeditions are another option at this point.

For about 23k a 4Runner or Wrangler Unlimited can be had. With the average annual repairs again about 500$ and 700$ respectively. If you want removable doors and panels, the Jeep. If you want a manual, the Jeep. If you want less repairs and longer term potential ownership, the 4Runner. If full time AWD is up your alley, find the right 4Runner. Tahoes would fall in about here as well.

Let’s go up another 5K. For about 28k he can get into the FJ Cruiser. They have crazy retained resale value right now. Pretty stupid to pay 10K more over a similar XTerra or 5K more over a similar 4Runner. But your only option for a manual full time AWD. This 28k will also put you into a LR4. But the LR4 is going to be about three times the average annual repairs as the $500 a year Toyota. You could also get into a GX460, that while nerfed from its true form, is still a fantastic platform. With about a 750$ annual average repairs and maintenance. And also fulltime 4WD. You could also go for an even bigger fuel expenditure and hit a Sequoia at this price.

Anyways, smart move on the XTerra. And the power train warranty is good insurance. Probably the smartest move out of all of the above.
The 4Runner likely the smartest move at the mid point.
Probably the GX is the smartest move at the 28k point.

I, of course, did the stupidest move out of the above choices.

[Adrenaline_6]

What??... No love for the upcoming Bronco? It's boxy...and will also have removeable doors...lol

[flenna]

Might want to see if it had the cooler bypass done to it. I THINK Nissan got the problem fixed prior to 2015, but a bad gasket, caused coolant to get into the transmission on the autos.

Lifetime on the drive train, nevermind.

That was a problem with the 2005-2010 models. I did the bypass on my 2007 Pathfinder as soon as I found out about the issue.