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Thread: Michigan Self Defense case with HUGE implications......

  1. #31
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    Florida adjusted this a year or two ago.

    Basically if you are justified in using deadly force, you are now also justified in threatening deadly force.

    The result is fewer people getting shot and fewer people getting charged because they DIDN'T shoot.

    Makes sense to me.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by 26 Inf View Post
    We have lost the perspective of an assumption of reasonable risk to ensure proper decision making. It has been sacrificed on the altar of 'I'm going home at the end of my shift, no matter what' dogma.
    Are you suggesting that police officers accept a level of risk that is reflected in the rate of pay and benefits that they receive upon accepting the position, usually negotiated in the form of a contract with the local union? I agree with this. You might get shot, it’s part of the job. That risk doesn’t provide police with a get out of jail free card that allows them to get away with crap other civilians could not.
    Far, far off topic, but it bothers me to no end that the term “law enforcement officer” persists. Cut that crap out. Go keep the peace and maintain order, don’t “enforce laws” unless you work for Customs. Obviously...to keep the peace, one must enforce laws. But that’s only one aspect of the job.
    “God doesn’t need your good works, but your neighbor does.” - Luther

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediGuy View Post
    Are you suggesting that police officers accept a level of risk that is reflected in the rate of pay and benefits that they receive upon accepting the position, usually negotiated in the form of a contract with the local union? I agree with this. You might get shot, it’s part of the job. That risk doesn’t provide police with a get out of jail free card that allows them to get away with crap other civilians could not.
    Generally, what you have posted aligns with what I believe.

    However, when pursuing this line of thinking: That risk doesn’t provide police with a get out of jail free card that allows them to get away with crap other civilians could not we need to keep in mind that in order to keep the peace, governmental entities send officers into situations that non-officers should generally avoid.
    "If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said a faster horse." - Henry Ford

    “You are responsible for your actions, but the world doesn’t turn around you, so it’s important that you find something bigger than yourself to work for, a way for you to make a difference.” - Drew Dix, MOH VN '68

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by 26 Inf View Post
    Generally, what you have posted aligns with what I believe.

    However, when pursuing this line of thinking: That risk doesn’t provide police with a get out of jail free card that allows them to get away with crap other civilians could not we need to keep in mind that in order to keep the peace, governmental entities send officers into situations that non-officers should generally avoid.
    Frequently it isn't involving official duty incidents and as much as anything else points to corrupt prosecutors and judges. Same thing often happens with affluent members of the community who aren't police as well. I really do think the double standard nonsense is a large part of why things are in the current seemingly deteriorating state it is in.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by 26 Inf View Post
    Generally, what you have posted aligns with what I believe.

    However, when pursuing this line of thinking: That risk doesn’t provide police with a get out of jail free card that allows them to get away with crap other civilians could not we need to keep in mind that in order to keep the peace, governmental entities send officers into situations that non-officers should generally avoid.
    Certainly, that has to be considered, as well.
    That also leads back to the role of police and overly intrusive regulation and administration, which isn’t something police themselves decide.
    “God doesn’t need your good works, but your neighbor does.” - Luther

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediGuy View Post
    Certainly, that has to be considered, as well.
    That also leads back to the role of police and overly intrusive regulation and administration, which isn’t something police themselves decide.
    And there is that issue too. A great many things shouldn't be illegal in the first place which means no legit reason for interaction.

    In other instances even when legal, such as open carriers being harrassed, we are back to multiple levels of corruption promoting and protecting wrong doing.

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