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Thread: Change my mind: a hybrid comp is the best general purpose muzzle device

  1. #111
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    Deleted and trying this a 3rd time but people arguing about split times and 1 way range 'gun gamer' nonsense is pretty ****ing gay (no offense to the gays out there I promise).


    Its sad how performing in courses and against timers have become so dominant when actually using these guns and when bullets are coming the other way throws most of that BS out the window.


    And yes I've seen the videos of different instructors with comps and other sponsored gear. Guaranteed if they were thrown into a situation the comps would be gone and they'd do just fine with a birdcage. Haley's favorite MD is a Surefire comp but under a suppressor on 1 way ranges. I like the SF comp too when Ive used them but not a gun that might get used inside my own bedroom or kitchen.

  2. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by lsllc View Post
    He made the leap you failed to.

    I never said comps don’t work.

    I said it was marginal and they do next to nothing.

    I still cannot figure out how you believe that performance cannot be measured. Again, if performance cannot be measured in some way, why buy one? I fully understand people are variable and don’t perform to the same level 100% of the time. But there are TRENDS in performance. But it sounds as though you’re arguing that there isn’t. If one performs the same standardized drill ten times back to back alternating between the same gear with the only difference being the comp, and you measure score, hit factor, etc, you’re arguing that doesn’t tell anything? If it doesn’t tell anything, then you must conclude it doesn’t matter. If it doesn’t matter, why should one buy one?

    Performance is quantifiable. Do you track your own performance? If you don’t, then can you determine if your training is doing something for you?

    Please, I want to understand how it can be “good and better in performance” if it cannot be measured?

    Also, I didn’t make this personal, and neither should you.




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    I'm confused now. Comp's work but do next to nothing? I think we're now talking pass each other. I agree that in the scheme of things they don't do wonders. Guys at Enos, bless their hearts, are always chasing the latest doohickey to get that edge. It took me a few years to get my rifle to where it is now and have pretty much left it alone. the trigger, comp, optic, handguard etc etc are about as good as I want it to be. It's a package deal...the trigger adds a little, the comp adds a little, the scope maybe adds a bit more to the overall shootability for me, and me alone.

    I do believe performance can sort of be measured, but a bunch of things would hinder a true and consistent outcome. One I've mentioned, the inconsistent human. #2 would be ascribing any performance change to a particular individual part. Rifles are a system and all the parts work together. So I take the trigger out after doing a bunch of double taps at 15 yds. So, I do it again with a mil-spec trigger and I'm .02 sec. slower on average with my mental and physical condition..for that day. Have I really proven much of anything? I don't think so. Even though the tuned trigger did next to nothing, I would still consider it a benefit to the overall system.

    Training? I dry fire and practice quad loading my shotgun in my bedroom when I have a spare 15 mins.. I work 2 jobs 60 hours a week and have been doing that for over 20 yrs. Sunday is my day of rest. I shoot 2 3guns on the 3rd and 4th Saturdays with a couple of friends. If I shot anymore I would be have some trouble with my wife. Maybe I can actually train when I retire here shortly.

    The reason I made it personal is that you don't seem to take into account people's experiences of a rifle and their benefits derived unless it is somehow measured and duplicated.

  3. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belmont31R View Post
    Deleted and trying this a 3rd time but people arguing about split times and 1 way range 'gun gamer' nonsense is pretty ****ing gay (no offense to the gays out there I promise).


    Its sad how performing in courses and against timers have become so dominant when actually using these guns and when bullets are coming the other way throws most of that BS out the window.


    And yes I've seen the videos of different instructors with comps and other sponsored gear. Guaranteed if they were thrown into a situation the comps would be gone and they'd do just fine with a birdcage. Haley's favorite MD is a Surefire comp but under a suppressor on 1 way ranges. I like the SF comp too when Ive used them but not a gun that might get used inside my own bedroom or kitchen.
    Another dissatisfied customer...I must really work harder to please you. I'll let my wife know how gay I am...that will be my penitence.

  4. #114
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    Yup. I stated that from the beginning. It’s a minor benefit....and to me, the cost is not with it...financially, increased flash, dust when in prone, and the confusion when inside.

    I’m not wanting to say they are universally good and should be used for “general use” as the topic suggests. I’m not willing to conclude they are the default setting anywhere outside gaming. And then I’m not sure that a comp vs no comp is going to be the decider in any situation.

    While a slightly different subject, many of the 9mm guys I know don’t use a comp because they say it slows them down because the muzzle dips.

    The WarComp I have seems to do the very same thing with certain loads.

    And one thing I haven’t seen mentioned is the fact that comps can sometimes rob accuracy. And I mean that from a benched rifle shooting groups slow fire. One of my rifles went to crap when I played with the comp on it. It was properly installed and torqued. Put the flash hider back and accuracy fame back.




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  5. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walker_Texasranger View Post
    I’ve seen complaints that it drives the muzzle down too much. That’s what kept me from getting one on my last gun, but I’ve never gotten to try one so I don’t know from personal experience.
    Have not had that problem with any of mine. I have 2 16inch ones, a 10.5, and I’ve put on about a half dozen for different friends and family. My 10.5 I have timed neutrally and if there was one that would drive it down it would be that one. I’ve shot the bcm comp and that one kind of drives it down compared to a warcomp. Honestly what’s probably happening is the guys are used to having to drive the gun back down after each shot they’re over doing it because the comp is keeping it flat but habit causes them to muscle it down when they don’t need to.

  6. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by lsllc View Post
    Yup. I stated that from the beginning. It’s a minor benefit....and to me, the cost is not with it...financially, increased flash, dust when in prone, and the confusion when inside.

    I’m not wanting to say they are universally good and should be used for “general use” as the topic suggests. I’m not willing to conclude they are the default setting anywhere outside gaming. And then I’m not sure that a comp vs no comp is going to be the decider in any situation.

    While a slightly different subject, many of the 9mm guys I know don’t use a comp because they say it slows them down because the muzzle dips.

    The WarComp I have seems to do the very same thing with certain loads.

    And one thing I haven’t seen mentioned is the fact that comps can sometimes rob accuracy. And I mean that from a benched rifle shooting groups slow fire. One of my rifles went to crap when I played with the comp on it. It was properly installed and torqued. Put the flash hider back and accuracy fame back.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I think this is most reasonable. Comps, for me, are for gamer guns. I use fh for my defensive guns.

  7. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomMcC View Post
    I'm confused now. Comp's work but do next to nothing? I think we're now talking pass each other. I agree that in the scheme of things they don't do wonders. Guys at Enos, bless their hearts, are always chasing the latest doohickey to get that edge. It took me a few years to get my rifle to where it is now and have pretty much left it alone. the trigger, comp, optic, handguard etc etc are about as good as I want it to be. It's a package deal...the trigger adds a little, the comp adds a little, the scope maybe adds a bit more to the overall shootability for me, and me alone.

    I do believe performance can sort of be measured, but a bunch of things would hinder a true and consistent outcome. One I've mentioned, the inconsistent human. #2 would be ascribing any performance change to a particular individual part. Rifles are a system and all the parts work together. So I take the trigger out after doing a bunch of double taps at 15 yds. So, I do it again with a mil-spec trigger and I'm .02 sec. slower on average with my mental and physical condition..for that day. Have I really proven much of anything? I don't think so. Even though the tuned trigger did next to nothing, I would still consider it a benefit to the overall system.

    Training? I dry fire and practice quad loading my shotgun in my bedroom when I have a spare 15 mins.. I work 2 jobs 60 hours a week and have been doing that for over 20 yrs. Sunday is my day of rest. I shoot 2 3guns on the 3rd and 4th Saturdays with a couple of friends. If I shot anymore I would be have some trouble with my wife. Maybe I can actually train when I retire here shortly.

    The reason I made it personal is that you don't seem to take into account people's experiences of a rifle and their benefits derived unless it is somehow measured and duplicated.
    Quote Originally Posted by TomMcC View Post
    Another dissatisfied customer...I must really work harder to please you. I'll let my wife know how gay I am...that will be my penitence.

    No offense but I couldn't care less what a 3 gun shooter has to say about HD/SD or duty guns. Gamer shooters don't interest me in the least.

  8. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belmont31R View Post
    No offense but I couldn't care less what a 3 gun shooter has to say about HD/SD or duty guns. Gamer shooters don't interest me in the least.
    I'll take no offense, but remember many things that started on the gaming field wound being used in the sd field. As an example...the weaver and the isosceles.

    I'd like to also say that I'm not good enough at much of anything related to shooting to be a teacher. I only related my own personal experience on a fairly narrow subject.
    Last edited by TomMcC; 11-03-19 at 23:06.

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belmont31R View Post
    No offense but I couldn't care less what a 3 gun shooter has to say about HD/SD or duty guns. Gamer shooters don't interest me in the least.
    Lots of tier 1 door kickers speak highly of the the benefit of competitive shooting and are gamers themselves.


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  10. #120
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    The hybrid comps are literally the worst of both worlds... They neither compensate very well nor hide flash very well. Pick one or the other.

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