HK91-FAL-M1A. Can't decide on a battle rifle.

[RetroRevolver77]

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[Esq.]

I don't see the benefit buying rifles or parts from no name companies especially for a mediocre rifle type system anyway. Maybe the SR25 would be worth getting into but not with that fugly shelving style rail they have now- so for me the AR10 type anything is a hard pass. At least with the FAL's, HK 91's, and M1A's- they are standardized, they are supported, there are tons of parts available for them and I don't have to figure which parts are going to interchange with a dozen varieties of AR10 madness that seems to be pumped out now. If you want to run a mixed bag of surplus ammo, match ammo, steel cased ammo- that's what the older style battle rifles are good for. If you want extreme long range precision, get a bolt gun. Just the retarded idea of the entire firearms industry turning everything into an AR is horrible; want a rifle get an AR, want a battle rifle get an AR, want a subgun type get a pistol caliber AR, if you want a 22 get an AR- there's just no creativity whatsoever. But wait, we got the inside scoop of some exciting news coming from Shot Show this next year- yet another rail system is being released for the AR, just stop. Some of us actually like variety.


RR77

I'm not sure what "no name" companies you are talking about and the AR10 is hardly a "mediocre" rifle system. The rifles you are talking about are not as "standardized" as you would suggest. How many gas plugs have you changed on a Poly Tech, Federal Ordnance or Norinco M1a? How well does a metric hammer work in an Inch or "Indian Pattern" Fal built on a Coonan, Enterprise or Century Arms receiver? Ask me how I know these things....I've been around a LONG TIME and played with ALL of the systems enough to know their ins and outs.

Now, I will certainly agree with you that the "AR'ing of All the Things" isn't very interesting. But, I'm putting rifles away for the end of the world...I want weapons with wide availability of parts that are easy to work on (because EVERYTHING BREAKS sooner or later) with good ergonomics and adaptability that I can support at reasonable cost from now until Hell freezes over.....

I enjoyed owning examples of all the listed rifles- Argentine, DSA and Springfield Fals, Gunplumber custom built Fals......I've owned Saco Import HK 41's and Pars Cetmes and Greek made Springfield SAR 3's...I owned a Devine, Tx. M1a and an LRB......If you haven't guessed I'm a student of weapons- I can run any of those guns very well....I understand their design, their history etc...All wonderful weapons...but, in the end, I made a decision to simplify my life.

[RetroRevolver77]

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[Esq.]

So much fail.

A self proclaimed student of weapons and you went NPC for AR's?

Trading factory HK's, M1A's and FAL's for PSA daily deals?

I thought I was among fellow collectors.

Thank you for explaining how many metric hammers you have fitted to Inch guns....etc....You know you're right when people try to ignore your points and deal in "what aboutisms" and "Look, shiny things to chase" type comments......

I'm not sure what you're getting at with the "NPC for Ar's" comments. I own many different AR pattern rifles, all with a purpose of their own.

[Danus ex]

The AR 10S shoot better generally. Yea, I know, everyone that owns a Fal has 4 that will shoot MOA with standard ball....That has not been my experience and I've owned over two dozen of them and seen/built/shot 50 or more over two decades. The same for G3s though their fans don't seem to be as rabid and vociferous....

Ar10s are far easier to accessorize with multiple companies offering multiple options for hand guards, buttstocks, grips, sights, triggers etc...

The guns are easier to maintain. I can rebarrel an AR10 with a vise attached to the hitch on my truck! I've actually done that with an Ar15! Good luck doing that with an Fal, G3 or M1a....hope you brought a pocket full of locking shoulders and a gauge to select the right one or a welder for the G3....

Good AR10s are sufficiently reliable for "duty" use. Just as there are some AR10s that are not reliable I have seen many Fals and G3 clones that would not run. Many were built with hard used parts of unknown origin and suffer from wear, tolerance stacking, substandard receivers and assemblers without the bona fides to truly build a high quality rifle.

I'm no expert at any of this but those are my observations.

Your experiences mirror mine—you had me at "pocket full of locking shoulders". I must've had 30 of those stupid things. I even custom ground a few until I realized they were actually soft enough to mill. At some point, all those rainy day parts become a pile of useless junk that your kids sell when you die.

The dumbest FAL problem I kept encountering (on 5 of 8 guns) was eroded gas tube retaining pin holes. I'd shoot 10–20 rounds, then lose the ability to cycle. Gas settings would make no difference, then I'd notice the retaining pin sticking out one side of the gas block inside the handguard (if it hadn't shot out altogether). Not a difficult repair with oversize pin stock and a reamer, but representative of the hokey acrobatics required to keep a FAL going.

I've tried the MR762 and I'll give the truer AR-10 a go next year. I've got the most interest in the KAC SR-25 CC, but I'm not sure I want to start by going $5k in. If I had to go back to the classics, I'd only consider giving a new production G3 another try.

[RetroRevolver77]

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[1168]

I've WECSOG'ed more FAL's from kits than I care to remember back in the late 90's and early 2000's.

This thread wasn't about who wants to buy an AR10; it's about FAL's, M1A's and G3 type rifles.


RR77

I suspect his point is that saying “FAL’s are standardized” is somewhat misleading.

I like the G3 type rifles, if I must go old-school, and .308. Count me as someone that would go SR25, given the option.

[mack7.62]

The good ol' days of the legacy battle rifles has passed, back in the 80's and 90's chances of getting a decent rifle with lots of military parts at a good price was much higher. Speaking of mainly M1A's and FAL's because I sold the HK 91 many moons ago and never looked back but really any of the 3 that you buy new today would have to go through a extensive vetting process before they can be trusted. So you have the choice of buying new, spending hundreds of $ in ammo to prove out, searching for and buying a good used M1A or FAL and still having to prove out, or trying to find a real HK 91 for around $2 K. Or for the same $2 K you can get a LMT Defender, a few hundred more should get you a SCAR H, or get a Mercedes SR-25 for $4.x K. The LMT, SCAR H and KAC are all military tested and proven, I am not that familiar with the HK 417 family but you could also include them, for that reason alone I would chose one of them for a serious use long term investment. The M1A's, FAL's, G3 clones, AK's and lesser AR-10's I would class as tier 2 or lower, some will be good to go, some will be mediocre, some will be failures. I enjoy the legacy battle rifles for what they are but have to admit it's easy to be spoiled by AR pattern rifles, if I could only have one it would be LMT or if I could afford it a KAC.

https://www.tombstonetactical.com/ca...in-20rd-black/

[RetroRevolver77]

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[Esq.]

Obviously there are inch and metric FAL's you just choose which way you want to go. That's why he confused me about trying to fit inch pattern trigger parts into an metric lower- which I wasn't sure why someone would do that. Anymore the real deal old school battle rifles are getting expensive- course so is the SR25. At least though if you have a mix of stuff, say G3's, FAL's, M1A's, AR's then you have an excuse for adding other types like AK's, AUG's, MP5's etc. However for me, I try to standardize on items that were widely distributed.

RR77

Which was one of the reasons I got rid of all my other patterns of rifles....Logistics. Now I don't need to worry about Fal Parts, G3 Parts, M1a parts etc....I have essentially ONE set of parts that happen to share many common parts with what is the most popular semi auto rifle in the country. In this country, at this time in history, there is no question but that the AR15 rules the market in every dimension.

I very well remember the days of $300 Aks and $99 Fal kits....The market has moved on for better or worse- and that part of it- is NEVER coming back...The Fal Kits and G3 kits etc...Were to the 90's what Mausers and Lugers etc...were to the 50's and 60's. There are still and always will be guys that want them but they are fewer all the time.

For me, simple is better. I'm at a point in life where nostalgia has yielded to practicality and I no longer care about, "Oh Yea, I have one of those"...