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Thread: Corbon .223 Rem 77gr. MPR for Home Defense?

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by vicious_cb View Post
    Its a bit slow but anything from light. Its the most violently cycling ammo in my inventory. Far more than any 5.56 pressure stuff I have.
    No doubt. I was just talking about velocity when I called it light, and used a poor choice of words.


    Quote Originally Posted by Uni-Vibe View Post
    Shoot Federal or Winchester M193 at $0.30 per round. 55 grains at 3100 fps does the job. The expensive stuff just blows a hole in your wallet.
    And what reputable source can you cite? Just because you cannot afford the $18 (when did this stuff go up?) it takes to load a mag of Fusion MSR or the $12 for Gold Dots does not make ball ammo better for home defense.
    RLTW
    “Yep, it's definite. I simply don't care enough what you think.” -SteyrAug

  2. #12
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    75 gr Gold Dot is good but seems to have a higher expansion threshold than medium weight GD/Fusion. It may also-again, in contrast to the midweight bullets-have unreliable performance through steel.

    77 gr TMK is an excellent defensive round for most applications, and is probably the most consistent and effective fragmenting 5.56 bullet out there. Be warned that funky things can happen with thinly jacketed hollowpoints at excessive velocities. I would keep the barrel length below 18" to ensure 12+ inches of penetration.

    M193 is a great round for stockpiling, and it's certainly not bad to use in a pinch. However, it is not as devastating as TMK, lacks the barrier blindness of GD/Fusion, and is much less consistent than either.
    Last edited by LimeSpoon; 12-02-19 at 20:13.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1168 View Post
    No doubt. I was just talking about velocity when I called it light, and used a poor choice of words.



    And what reputable source can you cite? Just because you cannot afford the $18 (when did this stuff go up?) it takes to load a mag of Fusion MSR or the $12 for Gold Dots does not make ball ammo better for home defense.
    Take a look at some shootings. Look at the radiogram of a M193 torso shot. The fancy stuff doesn't do any better.

  4. #14
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    Uni-Vibe - just stop. You have no idea who you are talking to. Some of us do.

    Take a time out and do some research on real data, or I'll be happy to put you in time out.

    I'm not asking.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by vicious_cb View Post
    Its a bit slow but anything from light. Its the most violently cycling ammo in my inventory. Far more than any 5.56 pressure stuff I have.
    Same. I believe it to be burn rate vs. dwell time (slow moving bullet leads to higher dwell time that the port is pressurized).

  6. #16
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    @Serious Student:

    I would like to respectfully disagree with your opinion. Based on my first hand experiences I have seen probably a half dozen to a dozen gun shot wounds in calibers ranging from 22 & 9mm to 50 BMG. Every single one of the victims survived except for the one shot by the .22 LR. Thats right.... the 14 year old Afghan that got hit with a 50 BMG and lots of shrapnel from the windshield, survived. Very talented surgeon, but the point still stands: the only calibers I have ever seen perform with certainty was 40mm and above. JDAMs and 500 pounders are choice. While I respect Doc's research and agree flat out there are better bullets, than 55gr/62gr; it is absolutely indisputable those two rounds together have put more bad guys in the dirt than any fancy bullet ever will. Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan and dozens of other shit holes have offered to be significant data samples. What I think he was trying to say was more along the lines of " It's the Indian, not the Arrow". I just feel that typical military ball ammo gets treated as the ballistic equivalent of a paintball, and a gold dot is the rod of god on the internet.

    I do keep 62gr Gold Dot in my Home defense gun. However; I wouldn't hesitate for a second if all I had on hand was my steel practice ammo.
    Last edited by turnburglar; 12-04-19 at 21:54.
    "Just throw Krylon on it"

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnburglar View Post
    @Serious Student:

    What I think he was trying to say was more along the lines of " It's the Indian, not the Arrow". I just feel that typical military ball ammo gets treated as the ballistic equivalent of a paintball, and a gold dot is the rod of god on the internet.

    I do keep 62gr Gold Dot in my Home defense gun. However; I wouldn't hesitate for a second if all I had on hand was my steel practice ammo.
    I dont think so...I think he was literally saying M193 has equal performance to the purpose build defense/duty ammo out there which is completely false. Maybe you havent read alot of uni-vibe's posts but some of the stuff he says is pretty out there.

    We can debate if the difference in performance makes a huge difference in the real world like you were alluding to, but thats been beat to death. Or you can just tell someone to get so good that they surpass terminal ballistics altogether because all their rounds are landing in between the eyes which leads to no discussion at all.

    I cant speak for everyone but stacking the odds in my favor by using good ammo is literally just me reading terminal ballistics stuff and shopping online for ammo while sitting on the can. Killing two birds and all that without the time, effort and $$$ it takes to get out on the range or take a class.
    Last edited by vicious_cb; 12-04-19 at 22:46.

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    All too often I see people drinking the defensive ammo kook aide. Yes it works. It works very well. But so does rifle ball ammo on humans. Like it has been said,” Many people are stopped instantaneous with ball ammo all around the world.” Many countries don’t even have access to defensive rounds. They don’t seem to have a problem killing humans. Autopsies all around the world prove that ball ammo from a rifle round works. Hell. Snipers take shots at over 800 yards with ball ammo and kill.

    Is defensive ammo better. Yep. Slightly. But not enough to make a difference if a vital organ is struck. Just take a look at the Mosque Shooting video. Plain ball killed all those people at close range. They dropped quickly.

    And another thing. I have been reading these threads. The banning of people who sing a different narrative is just sad. Is this a forum where one wants to read differing opinions? Or is it a forum where one has to toe the line or get banned?

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    Now that I think of it, ban me too. Permanently. I want no part of a forum where a moderator like Serious Student acts like a tyrant to those with differing opinions. I fought for my right to free speech. I realize that this is a private forum but regardless, it stinks. So I will shop elsewhere. What is this place? Arfcom? I came here from over there to get away from this BS. Looks like the likes of Arfcom has been infected here with Mods like Serious Student. And for the record, I have personally seen what a ball round from a rifle can do at CQB ranges.

    What a joke you are. Adios tyrant.
    Last edited by Marine Corporal; 12-05-19 at 00:39.

  10. #20
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    Musket balls killed a lot of guys back in the day, too.

    No one here said that ball ammo doesn’t work. Of course it does. But, if it were optimal, then why did military organizations develop Mk318, Mk262, and “optimized” with 70TSX? Why are police organizations using Gold Dot, TBBC, and RA556b?

    If someone can show me a reliable source that concludes ball ammo is BETTER or EQUAL for terminal performance, not just that lots of people have been killed by it, then I’m all ears.

    Edit: if you look through the ammo threads concerning terminal performance, you’ll note that the same user makes the same driveby shitpost in each of them. Going forward, I think we’ll stay on topic better if we just ignore it, unless he posts something with substance or source.

    This thread is about the viability of the Sierra 77TMK, as loaded by CorBon, in the role of home defense, and I maintain that it is a decent choice, assuming proper function in the user’s rifle.
    Last edited by 1168; 12-05-19 at 06:24.

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