We Just Got a Rare Look at National Security Surveillance. It Was Ugly.

[elephantrider]

But I think it's fair to say intent is a bit more complicated to prove than actions. I don't know if it's an IG thing or a Horowitz thing but he won't assign motive.

I'm old enough to remember when J. Comey was able to determine that H. Clinton broke the law, but wasn't guilty b/c he knew that she didn't have any ill intent. As for Horowitz, and his inability to assign a motive, it's probably a 'don't make waves,' thing as well as a 'don't piss off the FBI' thing. I think this point it's pretty clear what happens when you cross the FBI.

[Sry0fcr]

I guess you guys haven't been paying attention to the drug war... Seems like pretty standard law enforcement investigative tactics to make up or overstate evidence in order to get warrants. I suppose we should be thankful that Barron wasn't horribly burned by having a flashbang tossed into his bed while he was sleeping and that Don and Melania weren't killed in a hail of bullets during a no knock warrant service.

[glocktogo]

I guess you guys haven't been paying attention to the drug war... Seems like pretty standard law enforcement investigative tactics to make up or overstate evidence in order to get warrants. I suppose we should be thankful that Barron wasn't horribly burned by having a flashbang tossed into his bed while he was sleeping and that Don and Melania weren't killed in a hail of bullets during a no knock warrant service.

If the Democrats had the power to perp walk Trump out of the White House, it would've been done that way. I don't see what your point it though, because the IC facilitated the FBI's "parallel construction" of their sham case. This has Brennan's fingerprints all over it.

[Diamondback]

If the Democrats had the power to perp walk Trump out of the White House, it would've been done that way. I don't see what your point it though, because the IC facilitated the FBI's "parallel construction" of their sham case. This has Brennan's fingerprints all over it.

No, it would have been "shot while resisting arrest."

[Sry0fcr]

If the Democrats had the power to perp walk Trump out of the White House, it would've been done that way. I don't see what your point it though, because the IC facilitated the FBI's "parallel construction" of their sham case. This has Brennan's fingerprints all over it.

My point is that everyone is making this out to be an exception driven out of political ideology rather than just an outright culture of lazy, half-assed, ends-justify-the-means, illegal investigative practices.

I didn't make up having a bang tossed into a kid's bed, or a couple getting smoked in their own living room. Both recent cases were warrants based on trumped up or fabricated information...

[glocktogo]

My point is that everyone is making this out to be an exception driven out of political ideology rather than just an outright culture of lazy, half-assed, ends-justify-the-means, illegal investigative practices.

I didn't make up having a bang tossed into a kid's bed, or a couple getting smoked in their own living room. Both recent cases were warrants based on trumped up or fabricated information...

Well it appears I agree with you, hence the parallel construction comment, which happens as well. Shortcuts that violate Due Process are not cool.

[Todd.K]

My point is that everyone is making this out to be an exception driven out of political ideology rather than just an outright culture of lazy, half-assed, ends-justify-the-means, illegal investigative practices.

I'm on record saying at least some of this is confirmation bias. Probably how it started, they disliked Trump enough to believe the rumors and dossier.

BUT COME ON MAN, we have the same exact crew doing the exact opposite of overly aggressive, ends justify the means investigation of HRC to contrast.

I cannot reconcile the difference of those two investigations with "lazy". At some point I have to believe the people driving the investigation, "we won't let him" and "insurance policy", as to why they continued against the evidence.

I'm not convinced it started as a coup, but that doesn't mean it didn't end as a coup.

[murphy j]

That was easy more than "errors". If I had made these same errors on a simple warrant for whatever, I'd be facing perjury charges.

Friend of mine, local deputy sheriff who has written many a warrant, made much the same statement. He also included that to make that many errors was, in his opinion, willful negligence.

[Diamondback]

Friend of mine, local deputy sheriff who has written many a warrant, made much the same statement. He also included that to make that many errors was, in his opinion, willful negligence.

Also, you'd expect true "random error" to sometimes break to the benefit of one side occasionally rather than ALWAYS being to the benefit of the other.

"Once is happenstance, twice coincidence. Three times, now that's Enemy Action."--Auric Goldfinger

Gibbs Rule #39: "There is no such thing as coincidence."
" Rule #39A: "There is no such thing as a small world."
" Rule #40: "If it seems like someone is out to get you, they are."

And especially most relevant of all as the mea-culpas start...
Rule #42: "Never accept an apology from someone who just sucker punched you."

[murphy j]

Also, you'd expect true "random error" to sometimes break to the benefit of one side occasionally rather than ALWAYS being to the benefit of the other.

"Once is happenstance, twice coincidence. Three times, now that's Enemy Action."--Auric Goldfinger

Gibbs Rule #39: "There is no such thing as coincidence."
" Rule #39A: "There is no such thing as a small world."
" Rule #40: "If it seems like someone is out to get you, they are."

And especially most relevant of all as the mea-culpas start...
Rule #42: "Never accept an apology from someone who just sucker punched you."

Agreed. I've kept an eye on all this crap from the beginning. President Trump was not my first choice, but damn if I'm not enjoying the mental gymnastics and downright temper tantrums of the left.