All purpose tactical shotgun, pump vs semi?

[Eurodriver]

Bimmer, you and 1168 need to frequent places with more intelligent people.

I can’t believe you Don’t hear that often

[SeriousStudent]

They are all just tools. I have all of them - 1301, 870, 590A1, M2, M4, Browning Auto-5, Winchester Model 12, SBS's, double-barrel coach gun, etc. I think I have 10 shotguns in the shotgun safe, I'd honestly have to go count.

Practice, skill and reps pretty much wins. We were in a Tom Given's Shotgun Instructor class last year, and I won the Top Gun award. With an old Wingmaster that I decided to run for funsies. Because I knew my patterns, used good ammo, and didn't fumble a reload or short-stroke an action.

Practice feeding the pig. Do it over and over. Shotguns are just like mortars. Heavy, requiring manipulating single rounds by hand, but incredibly devastating when used with skill from a fixed position.

Buy something that is quality, and practice the shit out of it. Run Federal Reduced Recoil 8-pellet Flight Control Buckshot, and call it good. Not 9 pellet, and not Hornady.

Buy these, and practice like a madman: https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...prod67708.aspx

[hotrodder636]

Any specific reason on the 8 pellet?

The link for the Brownell’s dummy rounds said they are ‘discontinued’.

They are all just tools. I have all of them - 1301, 870, 590A1, M2, M4, Browning Auto-5, Winchester Model 12, SBS's, double-barrel coach gun, etc. I think I have 10 shotguns in the shotgun safe, I'd honestly have to go count.

Practice, skill and reps pretty much wins. We were in a Tom Given's Shotgun Instructor class last year, and I won the Top Gun award. With an old Wingmaster that I decided to run for funsies. Because I knew my patterns, used good ammo, and didn't fumble a reload or short-stroke an action.

Practice feeding the pig. Do it over and over. Shotguns are just like mortars. Heavy, requiring manipulating single rounds by hand, but incredibly devastating when used with skill from a fixed position.

Buy something that is quality, and practice the shit out of it. Run Federal Reduced Recoil 8-pellet Flight Control Buckshot, and call it good. Not 9 pellet, and not Hornady.

Buy these, and practice like a madman: https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...prod67708.aspx

[prepare]

Any specific reason on the 8 pellet?

The link for the Brownell’s dummy rounds said they are ‘discontinued’.

The 9th pellet is often a flyer.

Amazon has dummy rounds.

[hotrodder636]

Really? Had not heard that before but never read too much up on shotgun defense loads.

The 9th pellet is often a flyer.

Amazon has dummy rounds.

[SeriousStudent]

Prepare is correct. The way the 9 pellet load is layered in the hull, one of the pellets frequently gets impacted by another pellet. That gives a flat surface, and it veers off from the herd.

Federal uses lead with a higher antimony content, which is harder. Then they copper-plate the pellet. Hornady does not. The pellets frequently impact each other, and that leads to a looser pattern.

All but one of my shotguns can keep the 8-pellet within a 8-inch circle out to 11 yards. My 1301, two of the 870 Police Magnums, and the 870 SBS with the Secret Service barrel will keep it in 8" out to 16 yards. That's really damn impressive. Inside seven yards, those guns are basically hurling a pre-fragmented slug.

I've seen a lot of buckshot wounds, including 00 buck at contact range. Shotguns are very useful inside a specific niche. But in the words of my friend Darryl Bolke - that's a niche that a lot of people live in.

Know your systems and capabilities, and make your choices. There are still some good people teaching shotguns. Tom Givens, Randy Cain, Rob Haught, Wayne Dobbs, Darryl Bolke are all very good folks that I can personally recommend.

The Federal SKU you want is LE13300. I order it by the case from SGammo. Hope that helps.

[hotrodder636]

Thanks for the info SS....and the where to find the ammo.

[26 Inf]

No kidding. The lack of commonsense among PhDs is flabbergasting...

I hear what you are saying, and agree some folks don't have commonsense, but just as many of those PhD's are narrowly focused and don't have the breadth of experience as you or I may have.

And, when you think about it, tactics are constantly evolving, thirty years ago no one was pieing anything, now it is such a common place tactic that one would say that someone who doesn't apply the technique has no commonsense. Nope, just not the same breadth of experience.

Getting back to the whole “JUST GOTTA RACK THAT ACTION. EVERYONE KNOWS WHAT THAT SOUND IS AND WILL RUN AWAY" thing, back when I started training, we had two shotgun films that I relegated to the archives as soon as I could, they were titled Shotgun or Sidearm? and Shotgun - Second Weapon. One of them, I don't remember which one had a scene showing an instructor lecturing on the shotgun to a bunch of enthralled recruits sitting in bleachers. At one point he says something like 'snd when you get in close, nothing freezes everyone like hearing a shotgun rack.' The film was probably made in the early to mid 70's, I came across it in the 79-80 time frame.

So it wasn't only Uncle Joe.

[26 Inf]

I can’t believe you Don’t hear that often

Perhaps my range situation is a little different than yours. Except for matches I generally don't practice/shoot with anyone. I'm lucky in that if I'm on a firing line and someone shows up, I simply pack up and go to another location. Not hard given our layout:

Attachment 60414

[26 Inf]

Practice feeding the pig. Do it over and over. Shotguns are just like mortars. Heavy, requiring manipulating single rounds by hand, but incredibly devastating when used with skill from a fixed position.

Buy these, and practice like a madman: https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...prod67708.aspx

I can't find the Winchester Action Proving Shells anyplace, Brownell's is discontinued, so I've bought Fiocchi's from these guys:

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1018805265

Here is someone less expensive, in fact I just ordered 50 more:

https://www.ammosupplywarehouse.com/...ducts_id=20165