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Thread: Virginia NFA Suppresor Question

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by themonk View Post
    SOTs dont do stamps. They are an intermediary, it's just goes on their books. You sell it to Joe Schmo in FL > You find an SOT here in VA to take the transfer (they will probably charge you for this) > your SOT does the paperwork to transfer the can to their books > Joe finds an FFL that will do his transfer for him > your SOT will will then transfer it to his SOT in the ATF system > when they receive it Joe does standard paperwork to put the can under him personally or his trust by paying the tax ($200 tax stamp).
    I'm pretty sure this is incorrect.

    If an NFA item is on a form 4, it stays on one. Selling out of state would require the owner to transfer the item to a dealer in the buyers state on a form 4 ($200 tax), and then that dealer would transfer the item to the buyer (second $200 tax). This is how most machine gun sales happen these days, and I can't see how a can would be any different. Other than not being worth enough to justify the investment in time and taxes.

    As for VA, it's moot anyways. At this point if they outlaw them, the way the current house bill is written, a privately owned suppressor will be illegal to own before the first transfer (to an out of state dealer) has even cleared.

    The only real option other than just keeping a can (or giving it up, I guess) would be to move it out of state, either to another responsible person on your trust, or placed in secure storage.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tx_Aggie View Post
    I'm pretty sure this is incorrect.

    If an NFA item is on a form 4, it stays on one. Selling out of state would require the owner to transfer the item to a dealer in the buyers state on a form 4 ($200 tax), and then that dealer would transfer the item to the buyer (second $200 tax). This is how most machine gun sales happen these days, and I can't see how a can would be any different. Other than not being worth enough to justify the investment in time and taxes.

    As for VA, it's moot anyways. At this point if they outlaw them, the way the current house bill is written, a privately owned suppressor will be illegal to own before the first transfer (to an out of state dealer) has even cleared.

    The only real option other than just keeping a can (or giving it up, I guess) would be to move it out of state, either to another responsible person on your trust, or placed in secure storage.
    Tx_Aggie is correct. Two $200 stamps once it’s on a 4.

  3. #13
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    Interesting. I stand corrected that It would be two stamps. The owner pays $200 to transfer it back to a form 3 for your in state dealer. I was thinking you could transfer it to your SOT through an form 3 but it makes sense it would need come off the books over to the SOT's books - https://www.arsenalattorneys.com/fir...r-nfa-firearms

    "What about the transfer of a used silencer from an out-of-state seller? Assuming you’re able to confirm the condition of the silencer, it’s unlikely to be a good deal because an interstate transfer would add more costs and time to the transaction. Here’s why. The seller would need to submit a Form 4 with a $200 tax stamp to transfer the silencer to his local FFL/SOT. Then that FFL/SOT would need to submit a Form 3 to transfer the silencer to an FFL/SOT in the buyer’s state. Then the buyer would need to submit a Form 4 with a $200 tax payment to transfer the used silencer from the local FFL/SOT to himself. Besides the added expense of the additional $200 tax stamp, both dealers would likely charge transfer fees. Of course, two Form 4’s and a Form 3 would require more time to complete. Please note, if the out-of-state seller is an FFL/SOT, then only a Form 3 to your local FFL/SOT and Form 4 to you would be required."

    That being said SOT's dont do stamps. Once its on their books everything is in a separate ATF category (form 3).

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by tmwtrfwler View Post
    For those of us in Virginia with NFA items, specifically cans, what is the resale market for them?

    They're trying to outright ban suppressors. NO grandfathering. If passed you would have to destroy, send them out of state (sale/store them). Of course nobody would comply.

    For those that were to follow the law the question is do they hold any resale value out of state? What would that process even look like? Wouldn't it need two stamps? Via an FFL then to the purchaser? or direct to teh purchaser after their stamp is approved?
    Resale market is virtually zero. The wait and tax is the same for new or used. Buyer has no idea how many mag dumps have been through the used can. Plus, you are a motivated seller, along with a bunch of other Virginians. How about 5 cents on the dollar?

    Are you saying there is an overall Democrat agenda to ban suppressors, or that there is pending legislation banning suppressors. The only bills filed right now ban firearms with threaded barrels to accept suppressors.

    You can keep the can, you just can't put it on anything in Va.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack crab View Post
    Resale market is virtually zero. The wait and tax is the same for new or used. Buyer has no idea how many mag dumps have been through the used can. Plus, you are a motivated seller, along with a bunch of other Virginians. How about 5 cents on the dollar?

    Are you saying there is an overall Democrat agenda to ban suppressors, or that there is pending legislation banning suppressors. The only bills filed right now ban firearms with threaded barrels to accept suppressors.

    You can keep the can, you just can't put it on anything in Va.
    HB 961 includes a total ban on suppressors:

    https://legiscan.com/VA/text/HB961/id/2085429

    §18.2-308.10. Import, sale, possession, etc., of silencers; penalty.

    A. For purposes of this section, "silencer" means any device for silencing, muffling, or diminishing the report of a firearm, including any part or combination of parts designed or intended for use in assembling or fabricating such a device.

    B. It is unlawful for any person to import, sell, transfer, manufacture, purchase, possess, or transport a silencer. A violation of this section is punishable as a Class 6 felony.

    C. The provisions of this section shall not apply to (i) any government officer, agent, or employee, or member of the Armed Forces of the United States, to the extent that such person is otherwise authorized to acquire or possess a silencer and does so while acting within the scope of his duties; (ii) the manufacture of a silencer by a firearms manufacturer for the purpose of sale to any branch of the Armed Forces of the United States or to a law-enforcement agency in the Commonwealth for use by that agency or its employees, provided that the manufacturer is properly licensed under federal, state, and local laws; or (iii) the sale or transfer of a silencer to any branch of the Armed Forces of the United States or to a law-enforcement agency in the Commonwealth for use by that agency or its employees.
    The senate bill (SB16) that would've only outlawed using a can on a semi-auto centerfire was killed by in committee by the bill's patron on Monday.

    The much worse house bill is still alive, but last I looked hadn't been scheduled for a committee hearing yet. If passed as is it has a provision to allow possession of a currently owed can until Jan 1, 2021 (after which time possession would be a class 6 felony), but not for any sort of registration.
    Last edited by Tx_Aggie; 01-18-20 at 10:40.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by themonk View Post
    SOTs dont do stamps. They are an intermediary, it's just goes on their books. You sell it to Joe Schmo in FL > You find an SOT here in VA to take the transfer (they will probably charge you for this) > your SOT does the paperwork to transfer the can to their books > Joe finds an FFL that will do his transfer for him > your SOT will will then transfer it to his SOT in the ATF system > when they receive it Joe does standard paperwork to put the can under him personally or his trust by paying the tax ($200 tax stamp).
    Yes, SOTs do stamps if they are acquiring or disposing to/from an NON-SOT. So $400 to get a privately owned can out of state. Shoulda used a trust or llc.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack crab View Post
    Resale market is virtually zero. The wait and tax is the same for new or used. Buyer has no idea how many mag dumps have been through the used can. Plus, you are a motivated seller, along with a bunch of other Virginians. How about 5 cents on the dollar?
    Virtually zero only if you bought a shit can.

    I have sold used Knights Cans for over $1500.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by themonk View Post

    "What about the transfer of a used silencer from an out-of-state seller? Assuming you’re able to confirm the condition of the silencer, it’s unlikely to be a good deal because an interstate transfer would add more costs and time to the transaction. Here’s why. The seller would need to submit a Form 4 with a $200 tax stamp to transfer the silencer to his local FFL/SOT. Then that FFL/SOT would need to submit a Form 3 to transfer the silencer to an FFL/SOT in the buyer’s state. Then the buyer would need to submit a Form 4 with a $200 tax payment to transfer the used silencer from the local FFL/SOT to himself. Besides the added expense of the additional $200 tax stamp, both dealers would likely charge transfer fees. Of course, two Form 4’s and a Form 3 would require more time to complete. Please note, if the out-of-state seller is an FFL/SOT, then only a Form 3 to your local FFL/SOT and Form 4 to you would be required."
    Wrong again.

    In-state owner can xfer direct to out-of-state FFL.


    Quote Originally Posted by themonk View Post

    That being said SOT's dont do stamps.
    Still wrong. As I already stated "SOTs do stamps if they are acquiring or disposing to/from an NON-SOT"
    Last edited by Renegade; 01-18-20 at 11:05.

  9. #19
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    First a couple of Q's.

    Does Virginia currently require state notification/registration of NFA items? In my state, they don't have ANY information on whether I own a single firearm or NFA item.

    Second, would BATFE allow Virginia access to the NFA registry in order to hunt down NFA owners in their state?
    What if this whole crusade's a charade?
    And behind it all there's a price to be paid
    For the blood which we dine
    Justified in the name of the holy and the divine…

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tx_Aggie View Post
    HB 961 includes a total ban on suppressors:

    https://legiscan.com/VA/text/HB961/id/2085429



    The senate bill (SB16) that would've only outlawed using a can on a semi-auto centerfire was killed by in committee by the bill's patron on Monday.

    The much worse house bill is still alive, but last I looked hadn't been scheduled for a committee hearing yet. If passed as is it has a provision to allow possession of a currently owed can until Jan 1, 2021 (after which time possession would be a class 6 felony), but not for any sort of registration.
    Interesting. A search on the LIS page for "suppressor" returns the bills that use suppressor as part of the definition for assault firearm.

    A search for "silencer" does not return anything in 2020. A search for "silencer 2020" will return HB 961.

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