Quote Originally Posted by tim808 View Post
Thanks everyone for your advice!

I sent a link to this thread to my BIL and he appreciates the help.

I did mention to him that if he had to use it, the police could hold on to it for a while as evidence.

I think from his research, my BIL thinks a semi SG would be better than an Ar for him. I think he is going to compare them.
(I suggested a semi SG over a pump - easier to manipulate > greater reliability)

Or the Ar may be for his wife.

I have nothing against psa for someone with a small budget but he is well off and can easily afford 2 colt oems...which is only a little more than a psa (when your rich)

He has been in martial arts since high school but had to stop when he had kids and now he also helps his parents a lot.
He would use the rifle if he had to...but he is somewhat versed in escrima, stand up and jiu-jitsu. He is not fat. He has gained muscle and is fairly lean. This Vulcan is pretty tough. I think he used to help his police officer friend train other police and maybe a few swat. (His friend is pretty tuff too. While a cadet at the academy, I think he was better than the instructors so they asked him to help teach the other cadets)

Point is he is smart, rich and can go hands if needed.....so he’ll use it....but only if necessary .....like Spock :-)

My wife, her dad and her brothers are good in art and music. My BIL may be slightly attracted to the aesthetics of some “tools” and may be why he was leaning to a Noveske.

Thanks again for your advice!! It’s always good to get other perspectives


Tim and BIL,

The semi auto shotgun is NOT more reliable than a pump gun. I'm not sure how that ever made it into this thread, but it just isn't true. A pump shotgun is always going to be more reliable. Pump guns don't care about things like lack of lubrication from sitting in a closet for 6 years, dirt from not being cleaned in 6 years, or feeding a box of cheap shotgun shells. No, pumps don't like to be short stroked, but it still doesn't change that the pump is more reliable. Yes, I'm a shotgun instructor and shotgun armorer (large PD and state and manufacturer certified). I have carried and used a shotgun in an operational capacity, with multiple successful real world engagements.

Next on the list is to comment on which is better, an AR or a shotgun for defense. The simple answer is that the AR15 is a lower recoil, higher capacity, and more accurate weapon which also penetrates less in walls. In what way can your brother in law, yourself, or others think a shotgun wins this argument? Yes, along with being a shot gun instructor / armorer I am also an AR15 instructor / armorer and have used the AR15 platform to search and secure hundreds if not thousands of structures (residences and commercial), and have also used both shotgun and AR platform in MIL operations as well. If that isn't enough, I teach courses to LE, and civilians regarding use of force and tactics. Lastly, I am one of a few instructors able to attain a certain ranking / certification within the state, and I am also a multi platform and course instructor for various weapons and tactical classes.

Much like your BIL, I have spent a lifetime in the martial arts, and have used those skills more times than I can count while in uniform. There is a martial art / combative aspect that transitions from empty hand, to closed hand, and use of basic weapons like that bo and sai which carried over into firearms (at least if taught correctly).

If you or your BIL has questions you would rather not ask on the forum, feel free to email me. stickgunner@yahoo.com works well.