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Thread: (COVID/ETC CONTENT HERE) China Locks Down 11 Million in Wuhan,

  1. #2991
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    Quote Originally Posted by FromMyColdDeadHand View Post
    Stand back from the Straw Man....

    Yes, those would be.

    Banning all public meetings over 10 people during an upswing on the pandemic, which would include religious ceremonies, AA meetings, any orgy or sewing circle worth attending. Extend it past the needed time or single out churches, no bueno.
    So as long as they're equal opportunity tyrants, it's not a violation. Got it.

    Still begs the question, if they ban churches and school meetings, would that be OK? Or churches, schools, and daycares? How many others have to be included before it is seen as singling out, which is apparently the only qualification for it being a violation of the First Amendment? Does the scope of an emergency impact who broadly the mandatory, "will arrest you for practicing your religion" protection orders from the crown? Again, if the powers that be declare and emergency because someone is specifically targeting churches or other religious buildings, can they be shut down because they're the only ones at risk? Or do we need to drag others in so it won't be a violation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiskey_Bravo View Post
    https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2020/04...ical-supplies/

    Things are moving over the cliff quickly.
    Can't say I'm surprised. There has already been a great deal of vilification of Preppers and people who thought ahead and bought what they need. Only a matter of time before the agents of the crown were sent to remove needed items from peasants.

    Quote Originally Posted by WillBrink View Post
    About that "Spanish flu" which I'd always read was believed to have started in the US. That appears to have been incorrect, and the actual starting point for it now believed to be... wait for it... China, the gift that just keeps on giving:

    https://www.nationalgeographic.com/n...cience-health/
    Yeah, no, not buying it. That theory is incredibly flawed and seems largely baseless. It has gained renewed popularity in recent months due to Corona, but I still stand by it starting just down the road from me at Fort Riley.


    Intersting update on the USS Theodore Roosevelt

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/02/polit...ved/index.html

    Commander of aircraft carrier hit by coronavirus removed for 'poor judgment' after sounding alarm

    By Ryan Browne, Zachary Cohen and Jamie Crawford, CNN

    Updated 9:50 AM ET, Fri April 3, 2020

    Washington (CNN)The commander of a US aircraft carrier that has been hit by a major outbreak of coronavirus has been relieved of command for showing "poor judgment" days after writing a memo warning Navy leadership that decisive action was needed to save the lives of the ship's crew, acting Secretary of the Navy Thomas Modly announced on Thursday.

    "Today at my direction the commanding officer of the USS Theodore Roosevelt, Captain Brett Crozier, was relieved of command by carrier strike group commander Rear Admiral Stewart Baker," Modly said during a Pentagon press briefing.

    Modly told reporters that Crozier was removed for showing "extremely poor judgment" and creating a "firestorm" by too widely disseminating the memo detailing his concerns, copying some 20 to 30 people.

    He said Crozier was not removed because of any evidence suggesting he leaked the memo to the press, but rather for allowing "the complexity of his challenge with the Covid breakout on the ship to overwhelm his ability to act professionally when acting professionally was what was needed the most at the time."
    "I have no information nor am I trying to suggest that he leaked the information. It was published in the San Francisco Chronicle. It all came as a big surprise to all of us that it was in the paper, and that's the first time I had seen it," he added.

    The information in question was contained in a memo written by Crozier earlier this week to the Navy's Pacific Fleet.

    Modly called Crozier's note "a blast-out email to everyone he knows."

    "We are not at war. Sailors do not need to die. If we do not act now, we are failing to properly take care of our most trusted asset — our Sailors," it read, three US defense officials confirmed to CNN.
    Modly said Crozier was relieved because he went outside the chain of command and sent his memo over an unsecured system, adding to the chances it could be leaked.
    "He sent it out pretty broadly, and in sending it out broadly he did not take care to ensure that it couldn't be leaked, and that's part of his responsibility, in my opinion," Modly said.
    "I have received absolutely no pressure. I have had no communication with the White House about this," he added. "I did, when I was arriving closer to this determination yesterday, I called Secretary Esper and told him that this was the direction I was heading and he told me he would support my decision whatever that might be."
    Top Democrats on the House Armed Services Committee slammed the move in a statement Thursday.
    "While Captain Crozier clearly went outside the chain of command, his dismissal at this critical moment -- as the Sailors aboard the U.S.S. Theodore Roosevelt are confronted with the COVID-19 pandemic -- is a destabilizing move that will likely put our service members at greater risk and jeopardize our fleet's readiness," they said.
    "The COVID pandemic presents a set of new challenges and there is much we still do not know. Captain Crozier was justifiably concerned about the health and safety of his crew, but he did not handle the immense pressure appropriately. However, relieving him of his command is an overreaction," the lawmakers added.
    Modly on Thursday acknowledged Crozier's popularity among the aircraft carrier's crew.
    "I am entirely convinced that your Commanding Officer loves you, and that he had you at the center of his heart and mind in every decision that he has made. I also know that you have great affection, and love, for him as well," he said.
    Many on board gave Crozier a warm and loud send off, clapping and cheering as he left the ship, according to a video taken by a person onboard the ship and obtained by CNN.
    Number of positive cases continues to increase
    News of Crozier's removal comes after a US defense official told CNN Friday morning that 137 sailors from the Roosevelt have tested positive for the virus, representing more than 10% of all cases across the US military.
    The outbreak on the ship is escalating rapidly. Last week the Pentagon confirmed three sailors on the Roosevelt had tested positive, and that number had risen to 25 two days later. It rose to at least 70 on Tuesday and more than 100 on Thursday. On Monday, a US defense official told CNN that a second US aircraft carrier, the USS Ronald Reagan, is facing a "handful" of positive cases.
    In his memo, Crozier implored Navy leaders to take immediate steps to address the situation.
    "Decisive action is required. Removing the majority of personnel from a deployed US nuclear aircraft carrier and isolating them for two weeks may seem like an extraordinary measure," his memo said.

    "This is a necessary risk. It will enable the carrier and air wing to get back underway as quickly as possible while ensuring the health and safety of our Sailors. Keeping over 4,000 young men and women on board the TR is an unnecessary risk and breaks faith with those Sailors entrusted to our care," Crozier added.
    Modly said Wednesday that if it turned out the letter was leaked it "would violate the principles of good order and discipline if -- if -- if he were responsible for that. But, I don't know that. The fact that he wrote the letter of -- to his chain of command to express his concerns would absolutely not result in any type of retaliation. This is what we want our commanding officers to be able to do."
    On Thursday, Modly asserted that the decision to remove Crozier from his post "is not one about retribution, it's about confidence. It is not an indictment of character, but rather of judgment."
    "While I do take issue with the validity of some of the points in Captain Crozier's letter, he was absolutely correct in raising them," he said. "It was the way in which he did it ... that was unacceptable to me," the acting Navy secretary added.
    Sailors quarantined
    CNN previously reported that some of the sailors from the USS Theodore Roosevelt will be quarantined in hotel rooms in Guam as the number of coronavirus cases aboard the carrier continues to increase.
    On Wednesday Modly said 1,273 of the ship's roughly 4,800 crew members have been tested for the virus so far and the Navy was still awaiting the results of some of those tests.
    He said about 1,000 sailors have been evacuated from the ship and moved ashore to Guam where the ship is currently in port.
    "We already have nearly 1,000 personnel off the ship right now. And in the next couple of days we expect to have 2,700 of them off the ship," Modly told reporters at the Pentagon.
    Some sailors will have to remain on the ship.
    The Chief of Naval Operations, Adm. Mike Gilday, said that the ship could not be evacuated in its entirety due to the need to continue to perform essential tasks such as the operation of the aircraft carrier's nuclear reactor.
    He said that about 1,000 sailors would have to remain on the ship to perform, about 500 more than was proposed by Crozier in his recent memo.
    "This ship has weapons on it, it has munitions on it, it has expensive aircraft, it has a nuclear power plant. It requires a certain amount of people on that ship to maintain the safety and security of the ship," Modly said.
    What's interesting to me is that this parallels the history of TR quite well. Following the conclusion of the Span-Am War, he was concerned about the increasing risk of Malaria and Yellow Fever on US troops in Cuba, and the slow response the Army had to the problem. He wanted troops immediately returned home, and started a letter-writing campaign to make it happen. The Army eventually did so, but it cost TR his command (he didn't care, he was already running for Gov. of NY) and his chances of seeing the Medal of Honor. (which he eventually got, over a century later.)
    It's f*****g great, putting holes in people, all the time, and it just puts 'em down mate, they drop like sacks of s**t when they go down with this.
    --British veteran of the Ukraine War, discussing the FN SCAR H.

  2. #2992
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha-17 View Post



    Yeah, no, not buying it. That theory is incredibly flawed and seems largely baseless. It has gained renewed popularity in recent months due to Corona, but I still stand by it starting just down the road from me at Fort Riley.
    What I'm reading, there is no universal consensus where the virus originated, China, US, UK, and interestingly, Austria all mentioned as possibilities. First identified in the US in 1918, it appears to have existed prior to that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsbhike View Post
    "The stimulus package that just passed is the biggest wealth transfer from common folks to the super-rich (Wall Street and bankers) in the history of mankind. Done in the name of a virus with $1200 checks as the cheese in the trap.This will be obvious in short order.— Thomas Massie (@RepThomasMassie) March 29, 2020"
    The biggest transfer of wealth from common folks to the super rich was the Fed keeping rates artificially low during the financial crisis, paying banks to keep deposits at the Fed, and at the same time banks not paying any rate on deposits and yet hardly anyone even noticed. They essentially stole our savings and gave it to the banks who made poor choices and should have gone under.

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    Google is releasing location data in 131 countries to track if people are obeying isolation rules. Interesting times.


    https://www.silicon.co.uk/e-regulati...on-data-338372


    Location data is being released by Google in 131 countries so officials can see if people are obeying self-isolating rules

    The Google data comes after surveillance firm NSO Group this week claimed it was in talks with governments around the world about using its tracking software, which is already being tested by some nation states.

    Google’s analysis of location data meanwhile has come from billions of users’ phones (those phones with a Google account that has location sharing enabled).
    Whiskey

    May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one

  5. #2995
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillBrink View Post
    . First identified in the US in 1918, it appears to have existed prior to that.
    Yes. One of the theories why it killed mostly younger people is because a decade before (I don't remember the exact time frame) a less deadly version of that strain came through and many people survived and built antibodies. So when this came through the older people already had, at least partial, immunity to it

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    https://theintercept.com/2020/04/03/...s-coronavirus/

    "NEW YORK CITY police officers arrested three people in Brooklyn over the weekend after they allegedly “failed to maintain social distancing,” court documents reviewed by The Intercept show. The three individuals appear to be among the first in the city to be arrested over the Covid-19 mitigation measures — despite city officials promising that those disregarding the lockdown would face fines at most. Violating social distancing is not a crime per se, but each of the individuals arrested was charged with obstructing governmental administration, unlawful assembly, and disorderly conduct."

    Hummm, if it is not a crime... per se... then how do you charge them and arrest them. I think this is what you should be afraid of... you haven't done anything...per se... but we are arresting you and detaining you anyway.... to a nice detention barracks out in the midwest... ....

    Oh yea, not kidding on this either. Heard it the other day at Walmart over the public announcement system. They would warn people about maintaining the 6 foot social distancing rule, but if you kept violating it, you would be asked to leave the store.
    Last edited by teufelhund1918; 04-03-20 at 11:04.

  7. #2997
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    ... and here's this too:

    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/doj...plies-to-nj-ny

    "The Justice Department and Department of Health and Human Services are distributing nearly 200,000 N95 respirator masks and other medical supplies to New York and New Jersey after confiscating them from individuals hoarding the materials.

    Fox News has learned that the FBI discovered the supplies last week in New Jersey during an enforcement operation by the Justice Department’s COVID-19 Hoarding and Price Gouging Task Force and alerted HHS."

    WTF???

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    The fanned flames of fear and panic and ensuing madness, the resultant government boot necking, the ruined retirements, continuing lost jobs, folded and soon to fold businesses, efforts to build equipment there are not enough people to man, long term effects and changes,
    To place a speed bump in the path of a virus that may have taken out a few hundred thousand people that were already holding a ticket and near the front of the death line,
    And can come back every year,
    Is pure insanity.
    “Where weapons may not be carried, it is well to carry weapons.”

  9. #2999
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    Quote Originally Posted by ramairthree View Post
    The fanned flames of fear and panic and ensuing madness, the resultant government boot necking, the ruined retirements, continuing lost jobs, folded and soon to fold businesses, efforts to build equipment there are not enough people to man, long term effects and changes,
    To place a speed bump in the path of a virus that may have taken out a few hundred thousand people that were already holding a ticket and near the front of the death line,
    And can come back every year,
    Is pure insanity.
    Yes, it is.
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  10. #3000
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    Quote Originally Posted by 26 Inf View Post
    What do you think, good or bad?



    Would universal conscription/selective service in numerous countries fit your example?

    Living in society is a balancing act with the collective rights/well-being sometimes pulling against individual rights.

    My desire to listen to loud music on my patio while grilling, is tempered by the right's of my neighbors to not be forced to listen to the entire Eat A Peach CD at 150db.

    I don't see anything particularly onerous or difficult about the concept in general.
    Lets see, imagine being told you could not have outside lights. Drive with headlights. Not have blackout curtains. Fuel, tire and similar rationing.

    People I know who were kids in South Florida in ww2 used to go to the beach and watch the cargo ships burn which were sunk by Nazi subs.

    Blackouts were life or death situations for shipping as bright skylines were one of the main ways ships were spotted and targeted.

    Those people had a vested interest in not seeing those ships sunk as it contributed to the shortages and impacted the war effort. So while they may have grumbled, they did the right thing for collective good, under penalty of law.

    So despite all the paranoia, we've had worse restrictions in the past and they went away as soon as the crisis has passed. These will as well.

    Anyone who tries to make it law we'll have to deal with... oh wait we already have people trying to make 2A stuff law before the crisis.

    Yes there are some idiot politicians who are opportunistic. I think they will look like idiots, and very little of it will stick long term.

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