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Thread: New Data Suggest Florida Cops Have Broad Power to Take Away People's 2nd Amendment

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    New Data Suggest Florida Cops Have Broad Power to Take Away People's 2nd Amendment

    New Data Suggest Florida Cops Have Broad Power to Take Away People's Second Amendment Rights

    https://reason.com/2020/02/11/new-da...ndment-rights/

    A new report on Florida's "red flag" law claims Broward County's experience with gun confiscation orders confirms that they prevent suicides and homicides while guaranteeing due process for people accused of posing a threat to themselves or others. But the analysis by the Giffords Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence (GLC), based on 255 police petitions filed in the year ending March 9, 2019, actually reinforces the civil liberties concerns raised by red flag laws. In particular, it shows that the judges who are supposed to decide whether someone poses enough of a threat to justify suspending his Second Amendment rights almost always defer to the conclusions reached by law enforcement agencies.
    When police file such petitions, the respondent has no advance notice and no opportunity to rebut the allegations against him. The orders, which last up to 14 days, are supposed to be based on "reasonable cause to believe that the respondent poses a significant danger of causing personal injury" to himself or others "in the near future." In the cases covered by the GLC report, police always sought ex parte orders, judges always granted them, and they did so "very quickly," sometimes within hours.
    Last edited by tn1911; 02-11-20 at 17:08.
    Religion is doing what you are told no matter what is right. Morality is doing what is right no matter what you are told...

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    In other news, the sky is blue and water is wet...

    Of course judges just blindly take the word of cops and rubber-stamp these orders. Why would a red-flag case be any different than any of the other cases they rubber-stamp all day long.

    Critical thinking is hard. Jamming shit through so you can clear your docket, get drunk, and go golfing is easy.

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    Don't forget.

    Avoid any chance of political fallout.

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    255 Red-flag interventions and not one shoot out with the cops.... So much for going after dangerous people's guns. If these were really dangerous people, there would be a lot more bloodshed.

    I still think the biggest issue is that this SWATing allows access to anyone's house with out a warrant. How do you know someone has a gun? Slap one of these orders down and it is basically a MasterKey to everyone and anyone's house.

    Gun owners today have less civil rights than Commie spies in the 1950s...

    So stop and frisk is wrong and immoral, but tossing someones house is AOK?

    A threat is a threat. Parkland didn't happen because the threat wasn't known, it turned into a massacre because no one followed up, time after time after time (N+1).

    It's just back to the false notion that the gun is evil and if you remove the gun, you remove the evil. Like stopping terrorists from renting uhauls prevented 9/11...
    The Second Amendment ACKNOWLEDGES our right to own and bear arms that are in common use that can be used for lawful purposes. The arms can be restricted ONLY if subject to historical analogue from the founding era or is dangerous (unsafe) AND unusual.

    It's that simple.

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    I don't know if it is a typo or not, going off that article "reasonable cause" does not sound like probable cause. We detain on reasonable (articulable) suspicion, only long enough to confirm or dispel LE beliefs. The suspicion has to be reasonable given a similarly trained officer in the same situation would do the same thing.

    Probable cause is grounds for arrest. It is also what warrants are issued on, lots of people use the "51% rule" to describe it.

    This FL red flag law, at least how that article reads, looks like it treats these gun owners in question like psych evaluations. Those are used to send people to the hospital who pose a harm to themselves or others. Generally used on people who make suicidal statements, because if theres a credible threat on someone else, they go to jail, get arraigned, and are sent on their way with a court date and maybe sometimes a bond.

    This crap is really a shame and at some point, not just because of red flag laws, I believe judges, magistrates, and prosecutors are going to lose their immunity. They can say there is due process but really? Is there? Its like saying minorities commit 95% of the crime because that's what the stats show (paraphrasing mr Bloomberg).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Budget View Post
    This crap is really a shame and at some point, not just because of red flag laws, I believe judges, magistrates, and prosecutors are going to lose their immunity. They can say there is due process but really? Is there? Its like saying minorities commit 95% of the crime because that's what the stats show (paraphrasing mr Bloomberg).
    The reason this crap happens is immunity, either codified or in practice professional courtesy, and will continue to happen.

    One of the symptoms that has made it's way back in to the news.

    https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rap..._prosecut.html

    https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rap...outputType=amp

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    Exclamation

    The Soviet Union used “psychiatric evaluation” as a means of categorizing dissidents as “unstable” or “insane,” and incarcerating them.

    History rhymes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Budget View Post
    This crap is really a shame and at some point, not just because of red flag laws, I believe judges, magistrates, and prosecutors are going to lose their immunity. They can say there is due process but really? Is there? Its like saying minorities commit 95% of the crime because that's what the stats show (paraphrasing mr Bloomberg).
    Who's gonna take that immunity away?

    Another judge? The Supreme Court?

    I doubt that will ever happen.

    RFL's will be ruled unconstitutional by the USSC before they strip away judicial immunity
    Religion is doing what you are told no matter what is right. Morality is doing what is right no matter what you are told...

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    Quote Originally Posted by FromMyColdDeadHand View Post
    255 Red-flag interventions and not one shoot out with the cops.... So much for going after dangerous people's guns. If these were really dangerous people, there would be a lot more bloodshed.

    I still think the biggest issue is that this SWATing allows access to anyone's house with out a warrant. How do you know someone has a gun? Slap one of these orders down and it is basically a MasterKey to everyone and anyone's house.

    Gun owners today have less civil rights than Commie spies in the 1950s...

    So stop and frisk is wrong and immoral, but tossing someones house is AOK?

    A threat is a threat. Parkland didn't happen because the threat wasn't known, it turned into a massacre because no one followed up, time after time after time (N+1).

    It's just back to the false notion that the gun is evil and if you remove the gun, you remove the evil. Like stopping terrorists from renting uhauls prevented 9/11...
    I have read of at least one case where guns were taken from the wrong person. Mistaken identity, wrong person.
    That is one to many, that we know of.

    https://www.secondamendmentdaily.com...aken-identity/

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    folks need to turn this against them and start to turn in every single politician they can and every single leftist they can in any way they can and just flip it on them overwhelm them with requests etc...

    and any wrong thing like the above sue the freaking pants off them and drag them through courts and civil trials etc...

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