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Thread: Buying Your Pseudo-Military Stuff from China

  1. #1
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    Buying Your Pseudo-Military Stuff from China

    It seems like the involvement of American purchasers (both corporate and individual retail) in funding Chinese companies to develop better and better red dot sights, electronic devices, and so on will have only resulted in both capital and knowledge moving to an enemy of our way of life.

    Every person who buys a knockoff micro RDS (even from the “big names”) or scope, or even an iPhone, may end up being complicit in funding the design and purchase of weapons that will be used to fairly decent effect against US soldiers at some point in the future. Or do you think that those same companies wouldn’t be nationalized to produce those “as good as an Aimpoint” items the second we got involved in a conflict?

    It’s something that needs to be said. I’m all about free trade. I’m not a fan of DJT’s approach to economics. I’m all about distributing labor to lift the entire world out of poverty. But there’s a limit.
    I think we’re going to reap the wildwind on this. And I think it’s only honest to acknowledge our involvement, without the usual “well, everyone else is doing it, my purchase didn’t matter.”

    I don’t care about Harleys or Cadillacs, the Chinese can have those.

    Change My Mind
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    Buying Your Pseudo-Military Stuff from China

    Though I don’t completely disagree with your sentiment. Slick Willy sold China our strategic defense secrets during his term. In the grand scheme of things, small arms accessories are a small drop in the bucket.

    Also if the Chinese really want something, they’ll just fire up the corporate espionage servers. Ain’t no thing.
    Last edited by marco.g; 02-16-20 at 23:18.

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    The Chinese are fully capable of copying whatever they want at that level. Copyright infringement is kind of null and void in a state of war.

    Aimpoint is Swedish anyway. Your question should be why isn't there a US company that makes a competing product?

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    Buying Your Pseudo-Military Stuff from China

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrenaline_6 View Post

    Your question should be why isn't there a US company that makes a competing product?
    100% this.

    That said. Government needs to unfvck the cost of manufacturing in the US if anything is to ever change.

    Also, trijicon and Aimpoint had one job going into SHOT and they blew it miserably so I for one have no qualms about picking up a holosun 509T when they’re released. That’s how markets work.

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    Last edited by jpmuscle; 02-17-20 at 13:13.
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    "May end up complicit"? May?

    I'd bet there's some Talib in some cave in Afghanistan, right now, with a Holosun on his gun. A rugged, reliable Holosun developed in China using American dollars. And has very likely been used to shoot at American servicemen and -women in Afghanistan.

    There is probably some ISIS dude in Syria or Iraq, someone associated with Hezbollah, who is similarly equipped.

    Of course, there are probably also allied Kurds hunting said ISIS dudes with rifles so equipped, as well. And if it weren't for those cheap, Chinese-made red dots and LPVOs, plenty of our allies wouldn't have as great of access to these force multipliers, either.
    " Political tags — such as [...], communist, democrat, [...], fascist, liberal, conservative, [...] — are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire. The former are idealists acting from highest motives for the greatest good of the greatest number. The latter are surly curmudgeons, suspicious and lacking in altruism. But they are more comfortable neighbors than the other sort. "
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    And Aimpoint is based in a country even more Socialist than we are.

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    Daily reminder that automation is going to BTFO Chinese slave labor.

    Quote Originally Posted by jpmuscle View Post
    100% this.

    That said. Government needs to unfvck the cost of manufacturing in the US if anything is to ever change.

    Also, trijicon and Aimpoint had one job going into SHOT and they blew it miserably so I for one have no qualms about picking up a holosun 509T when they’re released. That’s how markets work.

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    Seems like every few months this same handwringing topic shows up.

    You know, a few years back I think it was either Soldier Systems or Breach Bang Clear that ran a couple stories about the Chinese apparently sending corporate spies to Shot Show.
    You really think they can't figure out how to set up a shell company and order whatever they think looks interesting?
    And even anything there is surely small peas compared to what their 'shaping op' guys are likely trying to acquire.

    I mean, like Marco said... it seems to me if they want it... they'll get it without our help...
    Also remember that several "good guy" brands with budget lines also have them made in some various overseas countries; places where, if we should be so worried about some tech or other falling into enemy hands, such tech would be even MORE readily accessible to sitcky-fingered chicoms.

    Also this is the same lame-ass argument the anti's always use for restricting everything. "B-but someone might use it against the forces of truth and justice at some point in the future...think of the children...the cops are so outgunned because civs have 'easy access' to scary guns and bullet stoppy thingies. Oh noes! Nooo, don't train civs in any sort of effective manner they might *gulp* ...know things...Don't buy that red dot from china because they might get something out of it..."
    It's old.

    As far as reaping the whirlwind... we already are.
    Look at how this Corona-virus is already playing out; China is so interlinked with us and everyone else that if they go down, even temporarily, it means heavy economic disruptions and shortages of supplies - some of them potentially critical- everywhere. Now imagine a war...
    The time for worrying about your purchases being used to fund the acquisition of tech and weapons to be used against us in the future has long sailed.

    That being said... I generally refuse to buy anything from China IF I can help it. Mainly because I refuse to buy into the false economy of cheap throwaway consumerism.

    However..., since the topic is red dots and cell phones, when the best a EU/US company can do is offer the SAME basic single-dot tube-design that's been around for decades, that weighs as much as a full variable scope and therefore in the era of 'lightweight everything' nobody wants to bolt on their rifle, and still costs $3-400+...
    Or they offer a "budget option" in the $150-200+ range, but it sucks...
    I get it; hometown labor and 'the good parts' are expensive, blah blah, etc. But we're talking BASIC RDS tech, not a long range precision scope...there's going to to be a price to pay when someone else shows up with an 85% solution that costs half the price/weight/etc, and you haven't beat them to it.

    If/when cheap chinese-brand phones start making it overseas... Apple is going to get slaughtered, because half the country is already fed up with overpaying for their "features".
    And yeah, they'll probably own our cell network after that. But it will be our own damn fault...

    But I mean... that's just my opinion.
    Last edited by Jellybean; 02-17-20 at 14:35.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrenaline_6 View Post
    . Your question should be why isn't there a US company that makes a competing product?
    Or, more specifically...."Why isn't there a US company that makes a competing product at the same price?"

    Given the choice, I'd prefer to buy an iPhone made in the US rather than an iPhone made in China...I'd even pay a little more for it. Until that's a possibility, well....I'm going to buy an iPhone.


    .
    Last edited by Hmac; 02-17-20 at 14:44.

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    A Chinese optic made today is quite different from the ones from 15-20 years ago.

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