The necessity of a light on an EDC pistol

[26 Inf]

I quoted you because you said you can't think of a situation a wml was needed. I provided a couple and like a child you have snarky incorrect replies.

As to removing the gun from it's holster, if you would stop running your lips and take classes you would know how to stay legal.
https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/...u-might-think/

Feel free to remain ignorant though, at this point I don't care anymore.

What I understand about that case is that it has little to do with the argument you are making.

[Vandal]

I have a WML on all of my regularly used pistols and HD rifle. I also carry a handheld light. It has many uses and I think people should run with both if your gun can support a 500 lumen or more light. Things like the TLR7 have taken away a lot of excuses if your smaller gun has a rail. Smaller guns with no rail should mean you're running a handheld light. The TLR6 is almost useless.

-G19.5 has a TLR7
-G17.5 x2, G19X, G21.4 all run X300Us
-AR uses a M600DF Scout

Handheld light-Surefire E2D Defender
Duty Light: Streamlight Singer DS LED HL plus Surefire Peacekeeper

I also carry a handheld light whenever possible, two when I'm at work. PID of your real or perceived threat is very important. How you chose to do that is up to you. I will say at a minimum a very bright handheld light is required if you carry a handgun. Don't rely on streetlights, moonlight, or other ambient light to help with PID or determining if that thing in the person's hand is a gun, cell phone, flashlight, wallet, OC spray, newspaper, shovel, etc. They aren't good enough.

Here are a few videos that may help some of you.
Sage Dynamics Basic Handgun WML Techniques
Sage Dynamics Handheld Light Techniques

[1168]

I have yet to see in any of these comments the ‘negative’ of the WML is that for direct light use, you will be pointing your loaded weapon in that direction. Something to be cognizant of even when using the light indirectly (what is on the other side of that wall, etc).

I have not trained in any low-light classes yet, is this something that is discussed?

Yes, this is something that tends to come up. It is a training issue. You must understand when it is, or isn’t appropriate to point a weapon at something/someone. To say that one should not mount a light on their weapon in order to avoid doing something dumb is similar to saying that someone should not carry a gun, because they might point it somewhere inappropriately.

[ramairthree]

My opinion is we have kind of reached a point where your CC, SD, HD, etc. guns should have a WML.

Obviously, your Production, SSP Guns, ranges toys, collectibles, neat ones to have, etc, are exempt.

If I bought an 1887 clone, an exposed hammer coach gun, and an old 1897 to play with- no light.
M2 for gun games- no light.
Home defense pump? Light.

[MistWolf]

I have qualified at night many dozens of times over the past 15+ years I have been carrying a WML and can only remember once or twice where the atmospheric conditions caused the smoke to obstruct my vision. Even then I was able to complete the course of fire by moving or turning off my light. Although this only happened at 15+ yards, at closer ranges I could still see my target. Indoors is likely worse but then you will be also likely closer than 10 yards. However it is definitely something you should be aware of and train for.

You are going to have your pistol out searching a whole lot more than shooting and that is where a WML really helps for target ID. While you may actually never draw for pure CCW you probably check out noises at night in your home so why not have a WML for that too?

Again training is everything so know how to use both a handheld and a WML. If you are only going to train with one option then definitely handheld first. Shooting with a light is a whole lot more than shining a light around to see stuff.

Dennis.

Every time I've used a WML in low light (centerfire & rimfire; rifle & handgun; suppressed & unsuppressed), smoke has been an issue. (This is NOT an argument against a WML.) When there's room, I move to a spot where the air is clear to keep shooting.

[Dennis]

Every time I've used a WML in low light (centerfire & rimfire; rifle & handgun; suppressed & unsuppressed), smoke has been an issue. (This is NOT an argument against a WML.) When there's room, I move to a spot where the air is clear to keep shooting.

I have the same experience when on a low light static range after firing many rounds given the right atmospheric conditions. However during qualification each stage is 12 rounds or less. I would hope that during an actual low light shooting I would be moving by the time I put 10+ rounds downrange.

WML light reflection off gunsmoke is a real issue that requires familiarization and training. However the 99% use of the light comes before the shooting starts and that is where it shines

Dennis.

[robbins290]

My Duty pistol has a TLR-1 on it and my CCW pistol has a TLR-7. I spend hours at a time walking thru the woods at night. No street lights or anything. Not having a weapon light is horrible idea. People will protect there "plants" with force and sometimes dispatching a sick/injured animal. A weapon light helps alot.

[Ron3]

For Duty and primary HD I say yes.

For carry, it's up to you. It's a no for me.

[Joe Mamma]

I am far from an expert. But, I have had some formal training in low light techniques/shooting, and have shot indoors and outdoors with weapon mounted lights and handheld lights. When it comes to a weapon mounted light on a carry handgun, put me in the "it depends on your situation, requirements, etc." group.

One thing I did not see mentioned in this thread is that the glare from the light and gunsmoke (which I agree can be very significant) depends on part on the tint or color of your light. Very small differences in light color can make big differences in the amount of glare. The bright white/blueish colored lights, which are common with LEDs, will often create a lot of glare with smoke. The white/yellowish lights create much less glare with smoke. My understanding is that it's the same reason a lot of fog lights on vehicles are yellow.

If I had enough time and money, I would test potential carry ammo to see what creates only a small amount of smoke, and test lights to see what creates less glare with gunsmoke.

One other thing I did not see mentioned for those that are going to use a weapon mounted light is that it's a good idea to test your gun with a light attached to make sure it doesn't malfunction. Sometimes the extra weight of a weapon mounted light can cause cycling issues with semi-auto handguns.

Joe Mamma

[26 Inf]

I am far from an expert. But, I have had some formal training in low light techniques/shooting, and have shot indoors and outdoors with weapon mounted lights and handheld lights. When it comes to a weapon mounted light on a carry handgun, put me in the "it depends on your situation, requirements, etc." group.

One thing I did not see mentioned in this thread is that the glare from the light and gunsmoke (which I agree can be very significant) depends on part on the tint or color of your light. Very small differences in light color can make big differences in the amount of glare. The bright white/blueish colored lights, which are common with LEDs, will often create a lot of glare with smoke. The white/yellowish lights create much less glare with smoke. My understanding is that it's the same reason a lot of fog lights on vehicles are yellow.

If I had enough time and money, I would test potential carry ammo to see what creates only a small amount of smoke, and test lights to see what creates less glare with gunsmoke.

One other thing I did not see mentioned for those that are going to use a weapon mounted light is that it's a good idea to test your gun with a light attached to make sure it doesn't malfunction. Sometimes the extra weight of a weapon mounted light can cause cycling issues with semi-auto handguns.

Joe Mamma

Good points. There is also such a thing as too much light.

Going back to comments from MistWolf and Dennis, my experience has been that gunsmoke has not been a big issue with the WML's that the average agency issues to their LEO's during our night fire course.

Two things, shooters weren't static, duty ammo general has reduced signature - including smoke. Now, if your shooting Win231, well, yeah...

Environment also makes a difference, indoors, versus outdoors.