Chinese Made Optics

[1168]

As others have stated, ChiCom optics is only a tiny portion of the problem. How many people carefully review components in their cars?

Years ago, I read a magazine article about American trucks, and the key takeaway was that the only trucks made in America were the Tundra and the Dakota. And the Dakota was discontinued the year before.

Mr Guns’nGear summed it up well. 99% of Americans simply don’t care. Take a look at Wal-Mart, or any of the “Dollar” chain stores. They’re not exactly going out of business. And me, I’m the biggest hypocrite. I’ve been trying to avoid Chinese stuff my entire life. And I’ve been spreading that gospel for many years. But I’m typing on an iPhone right now. Its several years old, but still Chinese. And everytime I inventory an ambulance or an aidbag, I can’t help but notice that nearly all the drugs and supplies are made in China. But I still use them. You see, the taxpayer buys my stuff. And they only care about a couple cents of short-term fiscal responsibility. Not about quality or the economy, or geopolitical strategy.

The only way Americans are going to stop buying nearly everything they buy from China is if it becomes expensive. Like a 300% tax on everything from China, or an outright embargo. But even then, the market would find a way to fudge the origins. Also, its not gonna happen, because the voting public would be butthurt; see above.

[Arik]

Years ago, I read a magazine article about American trucks, and the key takeaway was that the only trucks made in America were the Tundra and the Dakota. And the Dakota was discontinued the year before.

Mr Guns’nGear summed it up well. 99% of Americans simply don’t care. Take a look at Wal-Mart, or any of the “Dollar” chain stores. They’re not exactly going out of business. And me, I’m the biggest hypocrite. I’ve been trying to avoid Chinese stuff my entire life. And I’ve been spreading that gospel for many years. But I’m typing on an iPhone right now. Its several years old, but still Chinese. And everytime I inventory an ambulance or an aidbag, I can’t help but notice that nearly all the drugs and supplies are made in China. But I still use them. You see, the taxpayer buys my stuff. And they only care about a couple cents of short-term fiscal responsibility. Not about quality or the economy, or geopolitical strategy.

The only way Americans are going to stop buying nearly everything they buy from China is if it becomes expensive. Like a 300% tax on everything from China, or an outright embargo. But even then, the market would find a way to fudge the origins. Also, its not gonna happen, because the voting public would be butthurt; see above.

The market will definitely find a way to fudge origin. Remember reading a few years ago how the biggest Chinese export was actually honey. (Don't remember if it was the biggest food export or out of everything). It's mostly chemical and coloring. They ship drums of that shit all over the world until it finally cames to the US with a sticker "Made in Germany" or "Product of New Zealand". And then it's sold in supermarkets all over the US.

All my vehicles I make sure parts are ideally OEM or OEM supplier. If not then US made although I have been guilty of buying Chinese stuff. As recently as just after the new years. Had a 2nd vehicle I was selling. Good car, decent mileage but the bumper and fenders looked like crap. Because I was selling it and the job itself was around $1500 I didn't want to loose any more money so I bought Chinese bumper and fenders.

[Valhalla]

You & others keep intentionally mis-quoting me & others here. We NEVER said make everything 100% in America.

I quoted exactly what you posted, there is not even contextomies, let the least misquoting. Where in my quote did you say "100% America"? I am confused.

[Valhalla]

The only way Americans are going to stop buying nearly everything they buy from China is if it becomes expensive. Like a 300% tax on everything from China, or an outright embargo. But even then, the market would find a way to fudge the origins. Also, its not gonna happen, because the voting public would be butthurt; see above.

Now THAT is something refreshing from this thread - an idea that actually have a sound basis. Economist might tell you protectionism hampers growth, but "selective" protectionism will work in this situation because we are only taxing or blocking exports from China. I have a lot of friends in the import/export business and I can promise you the trade war negatively impacted China far more than us — including swaying US companies to move their production facilities away from China. Trump might not be able to keep his mouth shut, but as a businessman he knows how to play the economic game.

However let me play devil's advocate for a bit. Yes tariff can have very immediate impact, but right now Chinese are very short-sighted... they only know how to copy our ideas, or chase "lucrative" American contracts. When we take those contracts away, what happens then? Are they all gonna shut down their factories and starve to death? Well maybe... but my bet is otherwise. From an strategic standpoint, the worst outcome is we ended up forcing China to innovate. Like it or not, Chinese are smarter than us, and they outnumber us 4-to-1. Statistically, for every Steve Job that was born in America, FIVE Jack Ma was born in China. They don't t grow up as innovators right now firstly because IP protection is poor in China (that's changing), but secondly it is "easy money" chasing American contracts. If that's gone, the incentive to develop their own technology will surge.

For the rest of the folks, if you think I am making up excuses to defend China, go right ahead. All of our stuff is made in Ohio, we employ American workers, use American materials, and I am typing in a Sony laptop that's NOT made-in-China. (It is actually made in Japan - how many of you can say that?) I even drive a Toyota that is made in Indiana with more American parts than most Fords. I am probably more "American-supporting" than many of you who has been criticizing me, and you are welcome to buy your not-Chinese-made products instead of our American-made products. But besides the few who I now know cannot be reason with, thousands more will stumble across this thread and I am typing my reply for them. It is not that difficult to comprehend "economically exploiting your enemy", and to understand "the best way to keep a slave is to feed the slave well", especially when your slave is bigger, stronger, and smarter than you... who also happens to have nukes. (Otherwise the simple solution is to just shoot that slave in the head.)

I am sorry if I have offended anyone, and as much as I admire the patriotism here (I truly do), "preaching" boycott of China is ineffective at best, foolish at worst. The average Americans is not going to stop buying from China without drastic economic policy change, and even so, as 1168 had so elegantly put, fudging the origins, or under-reporting the cargo value, can easily circumvent many of these policies. If this discussion is to go anywhere, constructive suggestions that will actually make an impact are going to be much more useful. Arguing "I didn't say American only" or "just get out of China" is, let's face it, pointless... because that horse is long dead.

Personally, I still believe the best policy is to continue keeping them on the leash for as long as we could: even a pet tiger rarely bites the hand that feeds it. But if you cut that leash loose and stop giving it food, that big cat (or cute panda if you prefer) is going to find it's own dinner, and your head all of a sudden looks very appetizing. The point is, we haven't been screwed by China for the past 30 years (at least if you exclude the knock-offs). It's mostly been American corporations screwing Chinese factories for the past 30 years, and I vote we keep it that way.

Cheers,



Valhalla Tactical

[Don Robison]

When U.S. made red dots can start making reticles as clear as Holosun and Vortex I'll go back to then, until then I don't really care where it's made if it is a better product at a better price point. I'm tired of giving Trijicon a pass on their RMR for have almost adequate turrets and a sorta good dot. They have always been the standard because they were the only game in town that could take the abuse. Things have changed. Do I wish Holosun was a U.S. company and manufacturing; sure, but they aren't so it's not going to bother me. If you want to blame someone for the lack of U.S. manufacturing go take a look at unions and their brand of BS. They are directly responsible for driving manufacturing to China, so if you want to blame someone don't look at me look at unions and your union buddies.

[1986s4]

Globalization has been happening for thousands of years, Romans, Vikings, etc.. Smaller scale at first but now it truly is global. It simply isn't in our best interests to make everything we use in our daily lives right here. The manufacture of some items produces harmful by products, leave that to China. When I shop for durable goods I make sure they are not made in China. USA if I can, Mexico, Canada, Europe, India even, just not China.
But back to firearms, from this conversation it seems that the only firearm related items we are left with that could be Chinese made are optics, optical parts, etc.. Guns and ammo are not being imported anymore?

[RHINOWSO]

Also- I truly believe that there is a huge market for GOOD USA made stuff.
Are you not hearing a hue & cry now for more US made items?

Wow, emotion - the hallmark of successful business plans... <not>

[Mrgunsngear]

Do you not think the market wants it now?
I cannot understand why anyone at this point wouldnt be scrambling to get out of China.
Also- I truly believe that there is a huge market for GOOD USA made stuff.
Are you not hearing a hue & cry now for more US made items?

Time will tell on the market demand. It costs nothing to post on social media/forums that people will buy American goods but to actually buy the American equivalent of a Chinese product actually does cost the person. Additionally almost half of working Americans are out of work right now so the perceived cost is even higher for many.

"Also- I truly believe that there is a huge market for GOOD USA made stuff." I don't disagree but there's also HUGE government imposted costs added to American made goods that foreign companies don't have. Everyone advocating for American made goods should be advocating for the removal of corporate taxes at the federal/state level, Social Security taxes, excise taxes, unemployment insurance, etc.... that businesses are forced to pay stateside as 100% of those confiscatory fees are ultimately paid by the consumer. If that happens, then perhaps the supply of American made goods may meet the demand at the market rate.

[Five_Point_Five_Six]

Without resorting to all caps boomer posting, I will say that I won't be buying anymore chinese optics. I've never been a fan of using them for defensive use anyway, I have Aimpoints for that, but I've bought a couple Primary Arms and a Holosun for my kid's rifles and guns that get loaned to friends for range trips.

I'm not gonna go destroy the ones I own as some sort of virtue signal to win cool points with other AARP members either. You seriously look like one of those purple hair SJW chicks that yell at people all day on Twitter. Just stop.

[JediGuy]

I'm not gonna go destroy the ones I own as some sort of virtue signal to win cool points with other AARP members either. You seriously look like one of those purple hair SJW chicks that yell at people all day on Twitter. Just stop.

This.

I like my MRO, and I trust it as reliable, but I happened to get out a Primary Arms Advanced MRDS (blem model, actually) out to put on a M&P15-22 pistol yesterday. Looked through it and though, “Dang, that’s clearer and sharper than my Trijicon.” I’m not throwing it away, but don’t plan to buy more, either. I’ll save my pennies or sell something to buy non-Chinese for this type of product.