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Thread: 380 ACP

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskapopo View Post
    I disagree the main purpose in my opinion is to increase wounding potential with JHP's. That is also the reason people are buying them.
    I propose the main benefit is to reduce over penetration and that the slightly bigger hole and cutting increases the chance of death without reducing the aggression of the attacker.

    In other words I dont think expanding bullets in pistol calibers are likely to stop aggression any quicker in the short term than a non-expanding one.

    That being said jhp's are best for 9mm and similar power levels as long as they arent big-expanders that cut penetration heavily.
    Last edited by Ron3; 10-22-20 at 14:32.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron3 View Post
    I propose the main benefit is to reduce over penetration and that the slightly bigger hole and cutting increases the chance of death without reducing the aggression of the attacker.

    In other words I dont think expanding bullets in pistol calibers are likely to stop aggression any quicker in the short term than a non-expanding one.

    That being said jhp's are best for 9mm and similar power levels as long as they arent big-expanders that cut penetration heavily.
    I respect your opinion but disagree. A larger wound channel allows more bleeding which leads to a faster incapacitation. Also a larger bullet has more potential to nick an artery or any Oregon near the bullet patch. Basically a .75 caliber bullet destroys more tissue than a .355 one.


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  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskapopo View Post
    I respect your opinion but disagree. A larger wound channel allows more bleeding which leads to a faster incapacitation. Also a larger bullet has more potential to nick an artery or any Oregon near the bullet patch. Basically a .75 caliber bullet destroys more tissue than a .355 one.


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    The odds are small and even then the person shot wont know it and can still fight.

    For LE where events are often far longer it makes more sense.

    For the average CC guy it almost never goes that long and the shot BG either quits or needs braining. There just isnt the wait and see if they bleed out like some LE events.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskapopo View Post
    I respect your opinion but disagree. A larger wound channel allows more bleeding which leads to a faster incapacitation. Also a larger bullet has more potential to nick an artery or any Oregon near the bullet patch. Basically a .75 caliber bullet destroys more tissue than a .355 one.


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    Oh, I enjoy our discussions.

    I think weve been doing this since "shootersforum" or "shooterstalk" or whatever it was in the 1990's as well as Glocktalk and that David DiFabio forum way back!

    ".355Sigfan" 😎

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron3 View Post
    Oh, I enjoy our discussions.

    I think weve been doing this since "shootersforum" or "shooterstalk" or whatever it was in the 1990's as well as Glocktalk and that David DiFabio forum way back!

    ".355Sigfan"
    Yep itís been a long road. Stay safe


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  6. #56
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    In most handgun calibers you can have expansion, penetration, or a decent combination of both. Advances in bullet technology have given us that. I remember starting to have an interest in this terminal ballistics stuff 25+ years ago (the early 90's). I have both of the Sanow & Marshall books, take them for what you will. I recall the 1994 or thereabouts Handguns issue with the purported "Strasbourg Tests" in it.

    Having studied this stuff for a long time it seems that .380 just lacks the "oomph" to successfully do both expansion and penetration like calibers above it pressure-wise. That is why I use the Precision One 90gr Hornady XTP loads; they "expand" just a little bit and penetrate pretty well. Probably makes for an ever-so-slightly larger wound channel (and I do mean slight) while preventing over-penetration. That is the only handgun caliber I will load using Hornady bullets. The design parameters of .380 just prevent it from being much more than a very close range "Hail Mary" gun. Without a doubt, it's better than nothing or calling for help!

    .38Spl can shoot heavier bullets and with a little more juice behind it than .380 so IMHO it ranks just above .380 in the pecking order for handgun calibers. That said, the size/weight of modern .380's like the Ruger LCP is hard to beat, so you have to decide which you want to use for EDC.
    11C2P '83-'87
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  7. #57
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    I was listening to a P&S podcast on terminal ballistics as while back and one member on the panel suggested Speer Lawman FMJ for .380. It has better quality control then most generic fmj loads. I have to agree with this, with any of the sub calibers such as 380 and below penetration is the most important thing to want. FMJ for these calibers is what I would use.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis View Post
    Our only Dept authorized .380 carry ammo is Speer 90g TMJ due to reliability and ability to (barely) reach minimum penetration depth. This is after extensive testing in the LCP, Bodyguard, and G42 with all major loads.

    While a useless accomplishment, I can make consistent hits at 50Y on 10" steel with my LCP and Speer TMJ.
    I guess my point being it's all about good hits or I guess really any hits with a .380.

    Dennis.

    PS. I only carry the LCP as a backup to my G19 off duty or as a tertiary gun on duty ;-)
    Not useless at all. Shotplacement wins gun fights and if you can hit that well you are going to do even better up close.
    Pat
    Serving as a LEO since 1999.
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  9. #59
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    Lehigh claims their screwdriver tip .380 load makes wounds like 5.56? Hilarious. Even a screwdriver tip going 1000fps can't possibly match fragmenting 55 grain FMJ going 3100.

    5.56 wounds are nasty indeed.

  10. #60
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    After reading thru this thread
    I would like to say well done to all the posters
    Everyone has had good posts and no one has gotten mad
    at someone else’s posts

    Right now, I have critical defense in my beretta 84 BB.
    I’m willing to consider a better round if someone can convince me of the need to change

    When ammo prices come down, I am going to try the Speer fmj

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