Covid 19 Sci/med discussions only

[Averageman]

http://https://www.wsj.com/articles/...on-11596460191
A Food and Drug Administration effort to address a shortage of protective masks has instead opened the floodgates to 3,500 Chinese manufacturers’ selling products of widely varying quality, potentially putting the public at risk and leaving some U.S. states with stockpiles of masks they no longer trust as protective gear, a Wall Street Journal analysis found.

Facing a severe shortage of N95 respirator masks in the early days of the coronavirus pandemic, the FDA made an emergency decision to allow importation of millions of Chinese-made masks, generally called KN95s, that were supposed to provide similar levels of virus protection.

But the FDA itself created confusion about which Chinese brands could be trusted for medical use, in part by giving—then revoking—its stamp of approval to masks that turned out to be subpar. Some of the companies given initial approval were just weeks old or posted incomplete mask-quality tests, the Journal found.

We are so screwed it isn't funny. We are buying shit masks from our enemies.

[WillBrink]

http://https://www.wsj.com/articles/...on-11596460191
A Food and Drug Administration effort to address a shortage of protective masks has instead opened the floodgates to 3,500 Chinese manufacturers’ selling products of widely varying quality, potentially putting the public at risk and leaving some U.S. states with stockpiles of masks they no longer trust as protective gear, a Wall Street Journal analysis found.

Facing a severe shortage of N95 respirator masks in the early days of the coronavirus pandemic, the FDA made an emergency decision to allow importation of millions of Chinese-made masks, generally called KN95s, that were supposed to provide similar levels of virus protection.

But the FDA itself created confusion about which Chinese brands could be trusted for medical use, in part by giving—then revoking—its stamp of approval to masks that turned out to be subpar. Some of the companies given initial approval were just weeks old or posted incomplete mask-quality tests, the Journal found.

We are so screwed it isn't funny. We are buying shit masks from our enemies.

Thanx to prior admins ignoring warnings for decades this was a when, not an if, event, ignoring lessons learned from other nations who dealt with SARS, various sources telling the public masks don't work, and finally Obama admin failing to replace depleted federal stockpile of N95 respirator masks post the H1N1 influenza outbreak in 2009 even though they were warned about that.

When this crap is over, there will be a lot of finger pointing, and most of them will be right!

[PracticalRifleman]

My institution is getting shit masks. We are to the point we don’t use them when nobody’s looking.


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[HardToHandle]

Thanx to prior admins ignoring warnings for decades this was a when, not an if, event, ignoring lessons learned from other nations who dealt with SARS, various sources telling the public masks don't work, and finally Obama admin failing to replace depleted federal stockpile of N95 respirator masks post the H1N1 influenza outbreak in 2009 even though they were warned about that.

When this crap is over, there will be a lot of finger pointing, and most of them will be right!

Will, respectfully, the HHS and DHS staff were extremely well aware of this limited PPE issue. They raised PPE shortages to White House in mid January and almost nothing beyond staff work happened for three weeks. There seemed to be absolute paralysis amongst the National Security Council and the interagency process that has usually been at least moderately effective. The President’s tone is attributed to much of the trouble, but he has an abysmal team worn down by the witch hunts. At least five potentially productive weeks were squandered.

There is retroactive blame too, but there was an orchestra sitting idle while one guy seems to be fiddling over this fire in January and February. The Administration’s answer was to incentivize Chinese companies to create more mask capacity with billion mask orders....

Since this isn’t an AAR thread, but technical, the mask issue is really just backwards-looking regulatory issues made to sell newspapers. The continued issues to build a small amount of cushion in PPE and other critical supplies is the next issue. Let’s leave it a little vague, but remember the entire US COVID testing system continues to be on shaking footing because of a lack of sample collection Q-tips (gross oversimplification). Mass testing capability needs a supporting supply chain and that is where the big risk remains. The large testing vendors have been repeatedly warning they cannot scale for the flu season, let alone meet the present demand.

The pipe dream of contact tracing is pretty much collapsed in half the US; it will only get worse this fall. Unless there is a major breakthrough in testing (unlikely), we will see R0 spread stay well ahead of testing capacity until next summer. CDC has been signaling more symptom based diagnostics for at least five weeks.

[ABNAK]

When I have to go into a COVID patient's room I wear a CAPR. I have a beard so an N95 won't cut it. Today the CAPR I use wasn't in it's usual place so I had to call the RT that had it to bring it back so I could use it. If I can't have access to a CAPR, I ain't going in the room PERIOD.

We didn't see much during the March-April-May timeframe, but now is a different story.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

Study published in JAMA a couple weeks ago indicated that actual COVID case count is 6-24 times greater than official estimates. If this is true, then what good does testing do if for every known person testing positive there are another 6-24 unknown infected people wandering around?

[Averageman]

Study published in JAMA a couple weeks ago indicated that actual COVID case count is 6-24 times greater than official estimates. If this is true, then what good does testing do if for every known person testing positive there are another 6-24 unknown infected people wandering around?

I guess you can figure in the false positive tests and pretty much throw the baby and the bathwater out then?

[ChattanoogaPhil]

I guess you can figure in the false positive tests and pretty much throw the baby and the bathwater out then?

When I read about hundreds of labs sending in 100% COVID positive reports, and a County Health Officer having the gall to suggest on camera that a fatal motorcycle crash listed as a COVID death was because COVID caused the accident... that pretty much destroyed any credibility in the system.

[WillBrink]

Will, respectfully, the HHS and DHS staff were extremely well aware of this limited PPE issue. They raised PPE shortages to White House in mid January and almost nothing beyond staff work happened for three weeks. There seemed to be absolute paralysis amongst the National Security Council and the interagency process that has usually been at least moderately effective. The President’s tone is attributed to much of the trouble, but he has an abysmal team worn down by the witch hunts. At least five potentially productive weeks were squandered.

There is retroactive blame too, but there was an orchestra sitting idle while one guy seems to be fiddling over this fire in January and February. The Administration’s answer was to incentivize Chinese companies to create more mask capacity with billion mask orders....

Since this isn’t an AAR thread, but technical, the mask issue is really just backwards-looking regulatory issues made to sell newspapers. The continued issues to build a small amount of cushion in PPE and other critical supplies is the next issue. Let’s leave it a little vague, but remember the entire US COVID testing system continues to be on shaking footing because of a lack of sample collection Q-tips (gross oversimplification). Mass testing capability needs a supporting supply chain and that is where the big risk remains. The large testing vendors have been repeatedly warning they cannot scale for the flu season, let alone meet the present demand.

The pipe dream of contact tracing is pretty much collapsed in half the US; it will only get worse this fall. Unless there is a major breakthrough in testing (unlikely), we will see R0 spread stay well ahead of testing capacity until next summer. CDC has been signaling more symptom based diagnostics for at least five weeks.

You bring up important points to be sure, but to me the mile high view shows a general lack of prep and acknowledgement this would happen, not if it would happen, and added the slow start, are and were behind the curve.

[WillBrink]

A potentially important finding:

Does the Common Cold Protect You from COVID-19?

There are emerging signs that some people might have heightened protection against SARS-CoV-2, perhaps thanks to recent infection by other coronaviruses.

https://www.the-scientist.com/news-o...ovid-19--67792