To the LEO on this forum: Quit

[titsonritz]

There is no way in hell I'd work for one these big backstabbing blue cities, no way. I say let a couple burn to ground and then maybe others will pull their heads out of their asses.

[Averageman]

There is no way in hell I'd work for one these big backstabbing blue cities, no way. I say let a couple burn to ground and then maybe others will pull their heads out of their asses.

That this stuff happening in Blue States with decades of continued Blue Leadership should be no irony.
You either support the best Law Enforcement you can get and support continued training to prevent these things as much as possible. If you don't these things happen from lack of training and job burnout, it's human nature.
You start prosecuting DA's for over reach and over charging these crimes.
The idea of national standards for Law Enforcement really isn't a bad idea.

And I will just throw this out here.
You're not going to win the fight if your Officers can't use a manual choke hold or throw a fist. Your waiting for enough back up to dog pile the guy otherwise and that's going to take time the Officers involved simply don't have.
There is a giant difference between kneeling on my neck after I am in custody and putting me in a choke hold to gain control and custody.
Welcome to the purge man.

[gunrunner505]

Cops quitting is exactly what the left wants. They want to make the job of policing so unsavory to the type of person who would typically want the job that those people go and do something else. Now there is a void that needs to be filled and it will be filled by lefties. Liberal activist judges coupled with liberal activist police officers. It’s a commies wet dream.

Roving bands of brown shirts coming to a town near you. Make sure your papers are in order.


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[jpmuscle]

That this stuff happening in Blue States with decades of continued Blue Leadership should be no irony.
You either support the best Law Enforcement you can get and support continued training to prevent these things as much as possible. If you don't these things happen from lack of training and job burnout, it's human nature.
You start prosecuting DA's for over reach and over charging these crimes.
The idea of national standards for Law Enforcement really isn't a bad idea.

And I will just throw this out here.
You're not going to win the fight if your Officers can't use a manual choke hold or throw a fist. Your waiting for enough back up to dog pile the guy otherwise and that's going to take time the Officers involved simply don't have.
There is a giant difference between kneeling on my neck after I am in custody and putting me in a choke hold to gain control and custody.
Welcome to the purge man.

What about the latest incident suggests anything to do with lack of training? Ground combatives and weapon retention perhaps depending on how it went down but I’m still failing to see how anything about this is a bad shoot. I mean expecting LEOs to take a taser dart to the eye is asinine. I say that in general.

As to the national standard it exists via constitutional law and case law precedent. What you’re suggesting sounds more like having a national policy governing the use of force as a continuum, which it’s not nor should it be.

ETA:

If I’m being frank I’d argue the notion of nationwide systemic police “brutality” is an absolute fallacy. Are there instances of excessive force, general **** ups, and mistakes that should not be made? Absolutely and as such there needs to be accountability in these instances. But so many of these perceived issues stem from an abysmal understanding by the American population at large, of what use of force actually is under the law and how/what violence in real life actually is.


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[Grand58742]

My take as a 20 year LEO (military LEO, but still LEO)

Things have reached a breaking point. For far too long (both inside looking out and now outside looking in) things have gotten steadily worse for anyone wanting to choose that career path. Some of it is out of their control, some is well within their control.

Police by and large need to refocus on community and people first; not their political masters. They work for the people, not the government. Police should be the front line of defense against government overreach, not the action arm of the government. "You want someone to enforce social distancing because you're overreacting to a new virus? Have you considered sending out the City/County/State healthcare workers to do that?"

Enough of enforcing stupid traffic laws created by some idiot politician that has too much time on their hands. Post a speed limit and let the traffic go. We have accident investigators and civil courts for at fault accidents and things of that nature. if people are stupid enough to drive at 130 MPH when they can't control the car, by all mean, drive that way and kill yourself. If they hurt someone else or destroy property, hold them in account of the law. But enough speed traps looking for nothing else but to raise revenue or "you ran a stop sign so I get to search your vehicle."

Enough of enforcing (again) ignorant ass codes made up by (again) some useless politician. If it doesn't affect anyone else, stay the hell out of their life. We have way too many laws on the books already.

"Oh, someone's outside your designated First Amendment Zone and protesting on public grounds? Are they still within the United States? Because this whole damn country is a First Amendment Zone."

"Oh, you're angry the people showed up at your city council meeting and are protesting the ignorant fines you implemented without allowing the people a say and raised their taxes? Deal with it, the people have a right to speak out against their government when they feel they are being wronged."

And enough of saying "it's for safety" or "it's the rules." Stupid laws are stupid laws. Stop enforcing them and tell the politicians that you aren't going to enforce them. The "it's for your safety" has become so extreme, I don't even know if there's anything "unsafe" any more.

Go back to only responding to and investigating true crimes against people and property. "Hi Karen, the couple across the street is arguing again? Did he hit her or did she hit him? No? Sounds like that thing called "marriage" to me. Otherwise, it's not a police matter, Karen, stop calling 911 to report couples arguing."

"Hi Karen, is the neighbor's dog shitting in your yard again? Have you talked to them instead of calling the police? Maybe putting up a fence would work wonders for that situation..."

Real crimes that truly affect people. No more, no less. And become familiar with the people in your communities especially in the big cities. "Hi, I'm Officer Starsky and this is Officer Hutch. We're going to be assigned to your neighborhood and wanted to introduce ourselves. Here's a card with my number, my IBM and my supervisor's number. Please don't hesitate to call me direct if something happens. I hope to see you around."

Get out on foot and walk the streets, play ball with the kids, wave to people mowing their yards, get to know business owners, help the old lady carry groceries to her door. Become the helpful icon in the community rather than the hated henchman. Are some of the residents still going to be a-holes? Yeah, but the more ingrained one is with the community, the better chances they have of success. Work for the community and again, not for the political masters.

Get the hell rid of police unions that protect those who need to be fired and hire someone who can be an asset.

Most importantly, police need to straight up start telling politicians "no." Each and every police chief, sheriff and constable needs to be voted on by the people. Period. Enough political appointments. Best qualified for the job gets the job. Police should not be beholden to local or state politicians for their job. They need to be beholden to the people.

On the flip side of that equation...

Pay LEOs a decent wage for working in "trouble" areas. If they volunteer to work those areas, by all means, reward them for trying to make a difference.

Stop demonizing and painting every cop with a broad brush when the actions of one (or a few) are seen in a bad light. 95% of cops mean well and I believe at one point legitimately wanted to make a difference.

On that same token, LEOs are held to the same standard than the community if they commit crimes. No more, no less. None of this "held to the highest standard possible" extremist nonsense. Nor "well, the union says I can't fire them yet because I don't have a proper paper trail." They break the laws they are supposed to enforce they go through the same criminal system as everyone else. They use excessive force? They get charged the same as any normal person.

Tell your local politicians to stop making the police the bad guys. They protect and serve the people, not whatever the politicians decide is right or wrong. If they blow you off, vote their ass out. Period.

They are in a tough position being made far worse by the media as well as the idiots among the ranks that should have been gotten rid of years ago. Each and ever cop knows the good ones and the bad ones. Stop demonizing them where they are forced surround their fellow officers because there is no support on the outside. Take away the "us versus them" mentality that has become a chasm in the lives of every person who's ever worn a badge.

And just end the "war on drugs" for crying out loud.

[Alex V]

Like any dynamic confrontation, it can and will go in directions you don't control as history had demonstrated over and over and over. The North expected the the troubles with the South to be short lived for example, and "the numbers" suggested that would be the case. 600,000 dead later...

War sucks, civil wars make all other wars look tame by comparison.

Once you open the bottle, there's no putting the Jeanie back and what starts out a perfectly nice little conflict develops into a monster with it's own life and will.

Being we can't control what ends up being "a little un-civil" to teach some A holes a lesson they may deserve into something legit ugly, I'll still pass if possible.

If not, then do it with overwhelming force old school, without lube and done.

Maybe my view is myopic, maybe I am missing something but I just don't see this slide turning around or slowing.

The Left has the media and the angry mob and they won't stop until we are all Winston Smith, living in Oceania, scrounging around for razor blades. The war on police is just one front, and they will win it, mark my words. We either accept the inevitable, that we will be disarmed, and rolled into a socialist state/world order or it gets really ugly for a while. I doubt you want to drink Victory Gin anymore than I do, but do you really see this going any other way? I just don't want the slow burn, I'm not getting any younger and I don't want to have to deal with a civil war at 50, know what I mean?

[titsonritz]

My take as a 20 year LEO (military LEO, but still LEO)

Things have reached a breaking point. For far too long (both inside looking out and now outside looking in) things have gotten steadily worse for anyone wanting to choose that career path. Some of it is out of their control, some is well within their control.

Police by and large need to refocus on community and people first; not their political masters. They work for the people, not the government. Police should be the front line of defense against government overreach, not the action arm of the government. "You want someone to enforce social distancing because you're overreacting to a new virus? Have you considered sending out the City/County/State healthcare workers to do that?"

Enough of enforcing stupid traffic laws created by some idiot politician that has too much time on their hands. Post a speed limit and let the traffic go. We have accident investigators and civil courts for at fault accidents and things of that nature. if people are stupid enough to drive at 130 MPH when they can't control the car, by all mean, drive that way and kill yourself. If they hurt someone else or destroy property, hold them in account of the law. But enough speed traps looking for nothing else but to raise revenue or "you ran a stop sign so I get to search your vehicle."

Enough of enforcing (again) ignorant ass codes made up by (again) some useless politician. If it doesn't affect anyone else, stay the hell out of their life. We have way too many laws on the books already.

"Oh, someone's outside your designated First Amendment Zone and protesting on public grounds? Are they still within the United States? Because this whole damn country is a First Amendment Zone."

"Oh, you're angry the people showed up at your city council meeting and are protesting the ignorant fines you implemented without allowing the people a say and raised their taxes? Deal with it, the people have a right to speak out against their government when they feel they are being wronged."

And enough of saying "it's for safety" or "it's the rules." Stupid laws are stupid laws. Stop enforcing them and tell the politicians that you aren't going to enforce them. The "it's for your safety" has become so extreme, I don't even know if there's anything "unsafe" any more.

Go back to only responding to and investigating true crimes against people and property. "Hi Karen, the couple across the street is arguing again? Did he hit her or did she hit him? No? Sounds like that thing called "marriage" to me. Otherwise, it's not a police matter, Karen, stop calling 911 to report couples arguing."

"Hi Karen, is the neighbor's dog shitting in your yard again? Have you talked to them instead of calling the police? Maybe putting up a fence would work wonders for that situation..."

Real crimes that truly affect people. No more, no less. And become familiar with the people in your communities especially in the big cities. "Hi, I'm Officer Starsky and this is Officer Hutch. We're going to be assigned to your neighborhood and wanted to introduce ourselves. Here's a card with my number, my IBM and my supervisor's number. Please don't hesitate to call me direct if something happens. I hope to see you around."

Get out on foot and walk the streets, play ball with the kids, wave to people mowing their yards, get to know business owners, help the old lady carry groceries to her door. Become the helpful icon in the community rather than the hated henchman. Are some of the residents still going to be a-holes? Yeah, but the more ingrained one is with the community, the better chances they have of success. Work for the community and again, not for the political masters.

Get the hell rid of police unions that protect those who need to be fired and hire someone who can be an asset.

Most importantly, police need to straight up start telling politicians "no." Each and every police chief, sheriff and constable needs to be voted on by the people. Period. Enough political appointments. Best qualified for the job gets the job. Police should not be beholden to local or state politicians for their job. They need to be beholden to the people.

On the flip side of that equation...

Pay LEOs a decent wage for working in "trouble" areas. If they volunteer to work those areas, by all means, reward them for trying to make a difference.

Stop demonizing and painting every cop with a broad brush when the actions of one (or a few) are seen in a bad light. 95% of cops mean well and I believe at one point legitimately wanted to make a difference.

On that same token, LEOs are held to the same standard than the community if they commit crimes. No more, no less. None of this "held to the highest standard possible" extremist nonsense. Nor "well, the union says I can't fire them yet because I don't have a proper paper trail." They break the laws they are supposed to enforce they go through the same criminal system as everyone else. They use excessive force? They get charged the same as any normal person.

Tell your local politicians to stop making the police the bad guys. They protect and serve the people, not whatever the politicians decide is right or wrong. If they blow you off, vote their ass out. Period.

They are in a tough position being made far worse by the media as well as the idiots among the ranks that should have been gotten rid of years ago. Each and ever cop knows the good ones and the bad ones. Stop demonizing them where they are forced surround their fellow officers because there is no support on the outside. Take away the "us versus them" mentality that has become a chasm in the lives of every person who's ever worn a badge.

And just end the "war on drugs" for crying out loud.

IMO this would solve 90%, if not more, of the bullshit.

[1168]

Dude, you’re making entirely too much sense to be talking on the internet. Tell Karen to STFU, stop the war on drugs, end using police for revenue would go a long way. “Serve and Protect” policing would be awesome. Some places are already doing this to a degree, but could always get better, or better paid. Some places are doing the opposite.

My take as a 20 year LEO (military LEO, but still LEO)

Things have reached a breaking point. For far too long (both inside looking out and now outside looking in) things have gotten steadily worse for anyone wanting to choose that career path. Some of it is out of their control, some is well within their control.

Police by and large need to refocus on community and people first; not their political masters. They work for the people, not the government. Police should be the front line of defense against government overreach, not the action arm of the government. "You want someone to enforce social distancing because you're overreacting to a new virus? Have you considered sending out the City/County/State healthcare workers to do that?"

Enough of enforcing stupid traffic laws created by some idiot politician that has too much time on their hands. Post a speed limit and let the traffic go. We have accident investigators and civil courts for at fault accidents and things of that nature. if people are stupid enough to drive at 130 MPH when they can't control the car, by all mean, drive that way and kill yourself. If they hurt someone else or destroy property, hold them in account of the law. But enough speed traps looking for nothing else but to raise revenue or "you ran a stop sign so I get to search your vehicle."

Enough of enforcing (again) ignorant ass codes made up by (again) some useless politician. If it doesn't affect anyone else, stay the hell out of their life. We have way too many laws on the books already.

"Oh, someone's outside your designated First Amendment Zone and protesting on public grounds? Are they still within the United States? Because this whole damn country is a First Amendment Zone."

"Oh, you're angry the people showed up at your city council meeting and are protesting the ignorant fines you implemented without allowing the people a say and raised their taxes? Deal with it, the people have a right to speak out against their government when they feel they are being wronged."

And enough of saying "it's for safety" or "it's the rules." Stupid laws are stupid laws. Stop enforcing them and tell the politicians that you aren't going to enforce them. The "it's for your safety" has become so extreme, I don't even know if there's anything "unsafe" any more.

Go back to only responding to and investigating true crimes against people and property. "Hi Karen, the couple across the street is arguing again? Did he hit her or did she hit him? No? Sounds like that thing called "marriage" to me. Otherwise, it's not a police matter, Karen, stop calling 911 to report couples arguing."

"Hi Karen, is the neighbor's dog shitting in your yard again? Have you talked to them instead of calling the police? Maybe putting up a fence would work wonders for that situation..."

Real crimes that truly affect people. No more, no less. And become familiar with the people in your communities especially in the big cities. "Hi, I'm Officer Starsky and this is Officer Hutch. We're going to be assigned to your neighborhood and wanted to introduce ourselves. Here's a card with my number, my IBM and my supervisor's number. Please don't hesitate to call me direct if something happens. I hope to see you around."

Get out on foot and walk the streets, play ball with the kids, wave to people mowing their yards, get to know business owners, help the old lady carry groceries to her door. Become the helpful icon in the community rather than the hated henchman. Are some of the residents still going to be a-holes? Yeah, but the more ingrained one is with the community, the better chances they have of success. Work for the community and again, not for the political masters.

Get the hell rid of police unions that protect those who need to be fired and hire someone who can be an asset.

Most importantly, police need to straight up start telling politicians "no." Each and every police chief, sheriff and constable needs to be voted on by the people. Period. Enough political appointments. Best qualified for the job gets the job. Police should not be beholden to local or state politicians for their job. They need to be beholden to the people.

On the flip side of that equation...

Pay LEOs a decent wage for working in "trouble" areas. If they volunteer to work those areas, by all means, reward them for trying to make a difference.

Stop demonizing and painting every cop with a broad brush when the actions of one (or a few) are seen in a bad light. 95% of cops mean well and I believe at one point legitimately wanted to make a difference.

On that same token, LEOs are held to the same standard than the community if they commit crimes. No more, no less. None of this "held to the highest standard possible" extremist nonsense. Nor "well, the union says I can't fire them yet because I don't have a proper paper trail." They break the laws they are supposed to enforce they go through the same criminal system as everyone else. They use excessive force? They get charged the same as any normal person.

Tell your local politicians to stop making the police the bad guys. They protect and serve the people, not whatever the politicians decide is right or wrong. If they blow you off, vote their ass out. Period.

They are in a tough position being made far worse by the media as well as the idiots among the ranks that should have been gotten rid of years ago. Each and ever cop knows the good ones and the bad ones. Stop demonizing them where they are forced surround their fellow officers because there is no support on the outside. Take away the "us versus them" mentality that has become a chasm in the lives of every person who's ever worn a badge.

And just end the "war on drugs" for crying out loud.

It’ll be dark soon. Everybody stay safe out there.

[glocktogo]

That this stuff happening in Blue States with decades of continued Blue Leadership should be no irony.
You either support the best Law Enforcement you can get and support continued training to prevent these things as much as possible. If you don't these things happen from lack of training and job burnout, it's human nature.
You start prosecuting DA's for over reach and over charging these crimes.
The idea of national standards for Law Enforcement really isn't a bad idea.

And I will just throw this out here.
You're not going to win the fight if your Officers can't use a manual choke hold or throw a fist. Your waiting for enough back up to dog pile the guy otherwise and that's going to take time the Officers involved simply don't have.
There is a giant difference between kneeling on my neck after I am in custody and putting me in a choke hold to gain control and custody.
Welcome to the purge man.

I'll throw this out there. There should be specific criminal statutes for the bad conduct of DA's AND judges.

[SomeOtherGuy]

I'll throw this out there. There should be specific criminal statutes for the bad conduct of DA's AND judges.

Who exactly is going to bring those charges and hear those cases? Conflict of interest much?

Who watches the Watchmen?