Who will take the lead?

[rocsteady]

Mods, previous thread, short one particular earnest attempt at continually derailing it; had some meaningful points and I'm hopeful that this is enough of a different tact as to remain viable:

It is my understanding of the role of SF/Green Berets is to rally, train, unite and lead indigenous populations to stand up to their oppressor/enemy. if that is indeed the case, would it not follow that if these guys have the talent and the stones to go to some far off land, often paying the ultimate price for their efforts, and get rag tag groups of individuals, with probably less skill than your average "gun toting" M4cer, whipped into an actual fighting force; could they not be exactly what we are looking for to lead us at this point?

And I'm not talking some Rambo charge into the heart of Seattle but instead, showing exactly what the left is showing; some organization, a central message, proof that even the media can't ignore that we don't want these leftist/socialist/antagonists destroying the country that we love. I'm talking about getting together with those that want to stand up to this nonsense but don't have anyone with the experience and the cajones to lead it? And yes, I do see what is happening to those that have tried in small groups to stand up already but success seems to occur when large, at least semi-organized groups showing some will and resolve and ready and waiting when these leftists start coming into areas looking to get a foothold, set up shop and start tearing things down.

I've worked and trained with some of these guys in the last decade or so and honestly, they are a different breed. What's going on has to be especially galling for them as more than a few I'd wager, have lost teammates, friends and brothers while representing the sorry rest of us in practically every "shithole" this planet has to offer. How do we, hoping that we have half the bravado that we often show from behind a keyboard, let these real-life warriors know that we're willing to do something, anything, now, not later before it's too far gone.

I'm tired of defending every American virtue and being labeled racist/nazi/zenophobe/redneck/fascist/whatever, I'm tired of hearing how the flag is racist, I'm tired of hearing that it's okay to rip down and rewrite history, I'm tired of watching the corporate world bow to these race baiting psychopaths as they disgrace this country over and over again. This is not the America I want left for my kids, and their kids. I may not have the credentials to lead people to stop this crap, but I'd damn sure follow someone who did. And if no one steps up, I guess I'd have to put my money where my mouth is and give it a go anyway if I really am serious. I'd like to think that's how Trump came to actually want to run; that he really did just not see anyone stepping up to stop the Obama/Clinton/leftist snowball that was literally going unchecked...

I'm right in the middle of enemy territory here in Marlton, NJ and I want to know how we get the 60 million plus; I'd like to think closer to 80 million now, that would vote against the left to stop whining about shit on the internet (like I'm pretty much doing right now) and step up. For Christ's sakes, how much more of a foothold do we let these people have before we dig in?? Not everyone can fit in Texas...

[Honu]

How bad has it effected you being as you said in the middle of it ?

Can you safely go to the store ? In the eve ? Or only day ?

Have you friends loved ones Etc... had damage done to property ? Threatened ?

I hear ya I wait for the snap and when/if it snaps we might not snap back



The left antifa types riot destroy business for years and nothing has happened
Whoever posted that vid of the dude holding a rifle to someone and nothing ?
Reverse that and you will be in trouble


I won’t hold my breath for patriots fighting back UNTIL family loved ones start being heavily effected/killed and I think those in power on the left no to go just short of this and just wear folks down to compliance as we try to obey laws they ignore

[friendo]

I find it really disheartening that after 244 yrs. of living from the benefit of the actions taken by a well armed and regulated militia, all the while generation after generation being taught and tested in school what Washington and his army did to overcome tyranny and give birth to a free country, that we are now find ourselves at a loss for a solution. We were warned 244 years ago this might happen and probably would happen, thats why our Founders formed the Constitution and left us with instructions; keep your guns, form a well armed, regulated militia to protect the country we left you.

Now we sit on our collective asses wringing our hands while watching helplessly as the symbols and statues of those great men that left us this country are torn down and erased from our history.

Anytime I use the "M word" or word 'militia' I am automatically stigmatized as a far right extremist, whatever that is. I got a week ban from an AK forum recently because "talking politics was not what our General Forum is about." So much for free speech and open dialogue.

[soulezoo]

How bad has it effected you being as you said in the middle of it ?

Can you safely go to the store ? In the eve ? Or only day ?

Have you friends loved ones Etc... had damage done to property ? Threatened ?

I hear ya I wait for the snap and when/if it snaps we might not snap back



The left antifa types riot destroy business for years and nothing has happened
Whoever posted that vid of the dude holding a rifle to someone and nothing ?
Reverse that and you will be in trouble


I won’t hold my breath for patriots fighting back UNTIL family loved ones start being heavily effected/killed and I think those in power on the left no to go just short of this and just wear folks down to compliance as we try to obey laws they ignore

^^^ Like!^^^^^

[rocsteady]

I have friends directly affected with businesses trashed in NY and neighborhoods trashed in Philadelphia. I was having to make my way past and though what was well past protesting in Philly getting to and from work during the worst of it. Been "lucky" that nothing worthy of being called rioting has been any closer than 10 miles away or so from my home. But all it takes is that one trigger, the guy "re-creating" with his knee in his son's neck that got caught by someone's phone and the following days, it's happening right in your front yard, forget about "your own back yard." Was headed into the mob on 676 as a fellow employee got caught up and she had no way out. She was terrified, said she kept picturing the guy in the "old videos from LA riots,
getting pulled out of his truck and beaten." And now I see the aftermath, the businesses not coming back, the people that are moving away, the police getting no support, it's like a bad dream and it is not fixing itself.

[SteyrAUG]

Mods, previous thread, short one particular earnest attempt at continually derailing it; had some meaningful points and I'm hopeful that this is enough of a different tact as to remain viable:

It is my understanding of the role of SF/Green Berets is to rally, train, unite and lead indigenous populations to stand up to their oppressor/enemy. if that is indeed the case, would it not follow that if these guys have the talent and the stones to go to some far off land, often paying the ultimate price for their efforts, and get rag tag groups of individuals, with probably less skill than your average "gun toting" M4cer, whipped into an actual fighting force; could they not be exactly what we are looking for to lead us at this point?

Right off the top of my head Posse Comitatus prevents the US military from deploying on US soil to enforce domestic policy. Additionally the role of the US Special Forces is not to direct or influence policy in the United States.

The US would have to break down completely and dissolve before it would be permissible and then ironically enough that permission would no longer be necessary. Currently there is only one group advocating for "break it all the way down and start over" and that is Antifa and elements of BLM and other marxist based groups in that alliance. It's rather distressing to see anyone here who might be advocating the same and believing themselves justified because they are on the opposite political extreme.

And as the other thread demonstrated, there are some problems with a "rise up" faction of political conservatives which by their nature tend to be "conservative." Then there is the problem of political cohesion which was demonstrated on the other thread. Then there is the problem of what happens IF we rise up, what direction would it go and how would we fix it if we created something even more terrible.

CHAZ is a perfect example of be careful what you wish for. They were around for a month and pretty much only proved it you don't want the police, the police won't be there when a couple guys get shot, even if they are black and supposedly their lives matter so much. Obviously didn't matter enough, nothing they did prevented the shooting, the volunteers who transported the victims didn't do a very impressive job for their six blocks of constituents.

What do you imagine a nationwide reboot might look like with that as an example? 250 years ago we were far more cohesive as a nation and a people and we were still far from perfect. This second civil war shit has been around since the beginning of the internet and honestly even before the internet and sadly seems to be a step child of every firearms organization I've ever seen and every generation that comes along acts like they are the first person to discover it and it's "serious and they really mean it this time."

Currently the only place truly under siege was CHAZ and that happened only because the local populace supported it. The fact that the mayor of Seattle is batshit insane and City Council member Kshama Sawant is a member of the Trotskyist Socialist Alternative party is why it wasn't shut down immediately.

If you have actual communists in your local government you are at risk. I'd urge everyone in that situation to do everything they can to remedy their local situation. But that doesn't mean we need to restart the entire United States, some place are just fine and will continue to be just fine. Things could be better, but they could always be better.

[utahjeepr]

Those men you speak of have witnessed what civil wars really are. Nobody who has experienced that reality wants to see it happen here. It reminds me of that humpty dumpy rhyme. If we break this egg, it ain't going back together. Whatever happens, whoever "wins", what this country is will be gone forever. Whatever comes to pass on the other side will be less, and almost assuredly worse than what we have now. This nation is a unique construct, if we break it there will never be another like it.

Somehow we have to put aside the spectacle that our politics/media/social divisions have become. We ain't gonna fight our way out of it, how are you gonna get people to fight that are too freaking lazy to vote. We ain't gonna argue and blame our way back. Somehow folks are gonna have to pitch in together and work our way out. I fear that will never happen, but I hope. Until I lose that hope my "sword" will hang above my mantle to defend hearth and home.

If I ever need to buckle on my "sword" again to try to "save" some remnant of liberty it will be the saddest day of my life.

[SteyrAUG]

Those men you speak of have witnessed what civil wars really are. Nobody who has experienced that reality wants to see it happen here. It reminds me of that humpty dumpy rhyme. If we break this egg, it ain't going back together. Whatever happens, whoever "wins", what this country is will be gone forever. Whatever comes to pass on the other side will be less, and almost assuredly worse than what we have now. This nation is a unique construct, if we break it there will never be another like it.

Somehow we have to put aside the spectacle that our politics/media/social divisions have become. We ain't gonna fight our way out of it, how are you gonna get people to fight that are too freaking lazy to vote. We ain't gonna argue and blame our way back. Somehow folks are gonna have to pitch in together and work our way out. I fear that will never happen, but I hope. Until I lose that hope my "sword" will hang above my mantle to defend hearth and home.

If I ever need to buckle on my "sword" again to try to "save" some remnant of liberty it will be the saddest day of my life.

And THANK YOU.

Anyone who thinks they want a civil war should look at Somalia because that is what it looks like.

[rocsteady]

Right off the top of my head Posse Comitatus prevents the US military from deploying on US soil to enforce domestic policy. Additionally the role of the US Special Forces is not to direct or influence policy in the United States.

The US would have to break down completely and dissolve before it would be permissible and then ironically enough that permission would no longer be necessary. Currently there is only one group advocating for "break it all the way down and start over" and that is Antifa and elements of BLM and other marxist based groups in that alliance. It's rather distressing to see anyone here who might be advocating the same and believing themselves justified because they are on the opposite political extreme.

And as the other thread demonstrated, there are some problems with a "rise up" faction of political conservatives which by their nature tend to be "conservative." Then there is the problem of political cohesion which was demonstrated on the other thread. Then there is the problem of what happens IF we rise up, what direction would it go and how would we fix it if we created something even more terrible.

CHAZ is a perfect example of be careful what you wish for. They were around for a month and pretty much only proved it you don't want the police, the police won't be there when a couple guys get shot, even if they are black and supposedly their lives matter so much. Obviously didn't matter enough, nothing they did prevented the shooting, the volunteers who transported the victims didn't do a very impressive job for their six blocks of constituents.

What do you imagine a nationwide reboot might look like with that as an example? 250 years ago we were far more cohesive as a nation and a people and we were still far from perfect. This second civil war shit has been around since the beginning of the internet and honestly even before the internet and sadly seems to be a step child of every firearms organization I've ever seen and every generation that comes along acts like they are the first person to discover it and it's "serious and they really mean it this time."

Currently the only place truly under siege was CHAZ and that happened only because the local populace supported it. The fact that the mayor of Seattle is batshit insane and City Council member Kshama Sawant is a member of the Trotskyist Socialist Alternative party is why it wasn't shut down immediately.

If you have actual communists in your local government you are at risk. I'd urge everyone in that situation to do everything they can to remedy their local situation. But that doesn't mean we need to restart the entire United States, some place are just fine and will continue to be just fine. Things could be better, but they could always be better.

I'm not suggesting current, active SF swoop in and lead a rebellion or counter insurgency. I'm talking about someone rallying those of us that don't want every statue torn down, that don't want to be forced to use a different pronoun when some poor soul can't figure out if they're male or female, people that don't want to continue having our tax dollars used to attack political enemies of the left, who don't want to be fired for having an opinion that isn't supported by the mainstream media. How long do you just sit and let it happen without doing anything? Again, because it's relevant, like Trump took the reins on the ideology of at least half the country, when no one else was willing to put themselves through the wringer that he had to know was coming, but did it anyway. What if the next great SCOTUS judge just says no thanks because of the way the left was allowed to drop the hoax hammer on Kavanaugh; the next great president takes a pass as he doesn't want the three letter agencies turned on him and everyone he knows? I'm looking for that person or group that will show that it's not okay to suggest that members of an administrative get threatened when they're in public, that will stand up and say it's not okay to extort the country with a lie about systemic police brutality, that it's not okay to riot, loot, attack, burn and intimidate anyone who's politics are different from your own. Lots of people in my agency won't even voice an opinion as they don't want to deal with the extreme reactions of both other employees and the agency itself. That's not the way this is supposed to work and not something we can let continue.

[rocsteady]

We've done nothing while they've taken over our teachers, the education system, our colleges and universities, the media, Hollywood. So we just shrug and say, "well, we can't have a civil war so let's do nothing and watch it burn?" Of course civil war is not the answer, nowhere near that, and no one who has fought wants to ever see that, but to say we can't do that so let's do nothing is just as dumb. So, no disrespect, but don't restate the obvious, that we don't want a civil war, and just stop. Again, that's where you need people to speak up, step to the front, drag the rest of us along to show there's more to the country than what the media shovels out every waking minute. I don't have the answer and any fo knows the answer isn't all out civil war. But as the Chinese just showed, you can change an awful lot without firing a shot. So how do we change an awful lot, without shooting everyone? Who will lead that "movement?"